Eisernes Kreuz 2. Klasse Richard Sim or Souval

[Chrish124]

Hello all, I have been looking for a Iron Cross 2nd Class converted to a Knights Cross. I found this on a well known online dealer site. The ring is marked L/58 for souval. The Cross is being described as a Richard Simm converted to a Knights Cross during the war using a ring marked L/58. From what I have read L/58 marked Iron Crosses are post war productions. Setting that aside, the cross itself does not match any Richard Simm EK I have seen. I would love to purchase this if it was original but conversions are already a minefield, and something doesnt smell right here. Any advice would be appreciated.

[Chrish124]

PS: By stating that L/58 marked Iron Crosses are post war productions, I am referring to Iron Crosses 2nd Class by Souval with L/58 on the ring. I know they had legitimate L/58 EK1s.

[rbminis]

IMO, it is not a Souval.
Ralph.

[Woolgar]

I agree with Ralph... not a Souval cross

Nick

[Chrish124]

Here is a photo of the jump ring, that is marked Souval. So it seems the cross and the ring are from separate makers. The big question becomes if both the ring and cross are wartime productions.

[rbminis]

A little unusual that you have an extra ring in between the jump ring and the ribbon ring as well.
Here is my 93 marked, Richard Simm & Sohne to compare the cross.
Ralph.

[Nick Hessens]

Both cross and ring are post war Souval.

Regards,
Nick

[Woolgar]

Both cross and ring are post war Souval.

Regards,
Nick

Really? Did they change their design post war?

Nick

[Chrish124]

Thank you for the confirmation Nick Hessens. I contacted the seller again and even attached a photo from Mario Alt’s book that also confirms what you stated. The sellers response was that Dietrich Maerz approved of this as an original, war time, EK to KC conversion. As this seller frequently lists Maerz as having approved of various items on his site, it does make me wonder. That combined with the enourmous escalation of prices on his site will keep me from shopping there.

[Nick Hessens]

Did they change their design post war?

As far as I know; Souval had 3 frame types during the post war years. Whether they simply made a switch or were used alongside each other, I am not sure.

- Souval's wartime frame
- Souval's "Schinkel B" type
- St&L frame

The one on the OP is of course a St&L frame with a Souval dipping 3 core.

Adrian has already made a thread on these, see here, also check the link he provided. The description is not entirely correct though. While the cross on the right is post war for sure, the cross on the left (when unmarked) could be either of the two......

Regards,
Nick