My new Allgemeines Sturmabzeichen - is it real and who made it (unmarked)?

[MAP]

I'm back. To me this looks like "Unknown maker #10, type 1.27.2" (Frank Heukemes book page 296).

What catches your eye (beside the eagles head) is the very different oakleaf pattern on the wreath compare to other GAB's.

Now...the bad news.

The rear hardware (catch and hinge) appear to be replaced. At the top, there should be a raised "lip" on the reverse of the award to align the sheet metal hinge and then "crimped" into place on the top and bottom. On your example, it looks like it was ground down and then re-attached.

The catch should be round wire (tombak). This looks to be flat wire from the photos (but that does not necessarily mean it is not original, I'm just going by examples in Franks book). While these versions are known to have sloppy excess solder securing the catch, in this case it appears that the solder is on top of the silver wash. Typically the hardware is attached and THEN the wash is applied.

So my gut tells me that the top hinge and bottom catch broke off and were repaired. With original hardware, I can not be sure. And when this happened, I can not tell either.

The award should be priced accordingly based on these repairs.

These are just my views. Happy to be corrected by others.

Michael

[mjm1965]

Thank you Michael, appreciate the help and info.

[rbminis]

The rear hardware (catch and hinge) appear to be replaced. At the top, there should be a raised "lip" on the reverse of the award to align the sheet metal hinge and then "crimped" into place on the top and bottom. On your example, it looks like it was ground down and then re-attached.

If this correct for this maker, I would suggest you walk away as the hinge does NOT appear to be re-soldered to me. Better photos would help the situation.
Ralph.

[MAP]

If this correct for this maker, I would suggest you walk away as the hinge does NOT appear to be re-soldered to me. Better photos would help the situation.
Ralph.

Hopefully I am wrong and you are correct Ralph. But agree, clearer photos are critical.

[mjm1965]

Thanks guys.

I figured out the picture posting problem - need to use a camera instead of an IPOD.

I'll post up when I get it, but check these pictures out, which I pulled fro a thread on this site from 2015 (Allgemeines Sturmabzeichen opinions?). I am not seeing much of a difference:

[mjm1965]

Here is mine again. Re the crimp t the top - on the other one, it looks like they soldered over the square backing to the hinge, whereas in mine it looks more stuck on - though I am seeing some solder there - possibly silver wash. Note the brass catch as well. at any rate, I am noob and really have no idea....

[rbminis]

Can you take a photo or two similar to this this?
Ralph.

[mjm1965]

Do these pics help?

[MAP]

They help a tiny bit. But still inconclusive. If you look at ralphs photo example, you can see his angle is higher and the catch takes up the majority of the photo.

Basically what we are trying to determine is if there is a raised outline that acted as a guide to place and solder the catch. Look at Ralphs photo and you can see an example of the raised section (note however that it is from a different maker and thus a different shape).

I typically don't do this. But here is a scan of the image in the book. This is what you need to look for. Further there should be a crimp at the top and bottom of the hinge base plate. Yours does not have it. If you look at the other example that you found you can just slightly see the edge of the raised guide (in red box) as well as the crimp (albeit messy and covered with solder) at the front bottom of the hinge plate under the pin.

[rbminis]

I don't believe I see any traces of a border and the solder appears to be original.
I also notice that the catch is made from flat plate or sheet.
I believe maker #10, type 1.27.2 only used a round wire catch. I still think this is an original badge, just not this maker.
Ralph.