Mouse's next site (and Jays)

[TonyE]

In the attached copy of your picture I have arrowed a projectile that looks like a 15mm BESA. It has the distinctive double driving band formed in the envelope. Can you confirm that it is about 15mm in diameter please?

If so, it is another odd find as the 15mm BESA was only used in a few armoured vehicles and not by the RAF AFAIK. Picture of AP and drill round attached. (The item on the right is an armourer's headspace gauge for the 15mm BESA)

Sorry to be pedantic, but I should also point out that live ammunition, no matter how relic, is still live ammunition and requires a Firearms Certificate to possess.

Regards
TonyE

[dangermouse]

Hi Tony, thanks for the ID at WaP I have just got back from another run to the site, had about 5 hours there and came back with a mountain of stuff.

Well surprise surprise... some pics when upload dont work... i upload them repeatedly, change the names, change the size... an no! So, you cant have a picture of everything.

Attachment 377748 Attachment 377749 Attachment 377750

now the pic of the .50 cal in the ground wont upload so imagine a dirty .50 cal in the ground... thats what it looks like


Total finds
Piat fuze case female x24
Piat fuze case male x30
Small Piat fuze case female x2
Small Piat fuze case male x3
Large PIAT fuze x7
Small PIAT fuze x2
Small PIAT fuze marked Drill with hole x3
.50 x2
BOYES x1
.30-06 Traing x 1 + 3/4
Ninja death stars? 3 sizes x11
Elephant gun cartridges x2
plus other misc carp

Mouse x

- - Updated - -

here are the first 3 pics AGAIN!

[TonyE]

Hi Mouse

Your Ninja Death Stars are carriers for artillery rounds. They clip over the rim of the cartridge case and have a fabric loop for carrying. They also act as protectors for the primer. Hard to tell for what calibre they are, but could be for 18Pr or 25 Pr. If they clean up you may be able to get a number of off of one and that should identify it.

Did you manage to measure the proj. I asked about?

...and can I have a close up and dimensions of your "elephant gun" cartridge cases please!

Cheers
TonyE

[Steve T]

DM

I had already id'd you ninja stars for Jay a week ago. Judging by the size, they are likely to be protectors for 2lber shells upwards. They look too small for 18 or 25lbers.

The wheel thingy looks like it is off an American mine.

[jayh]

Hi tony I have not had chance to measure it yet but It looks to be about 15mm ? I have also found a couple of weird cartridges
1 that has the maker 'western' and the numbers 6-15 looks like a large French lebel cartridge?
And another that has the letter m and 1v this cartridge is Approx twice the diameter of a shotgun cartridge ? I will try to post some pics if I can or I can email them to you if you like

[TonyE]

That certainly sounds like a WWI contract 8mm Lebel by Western Cartrdidge Co. The headstamp dates fit.

The other one (M IV) is almost certainly a Mark IV flare cartridge I will PM you with my e-mail address.

Steve - sorry, I did not see your ID of the carriers. I agree that they look like 2 Pr from the scale of the pictures. I was simply using 18Pr and 25 Pr as examples of the sort of fixed rounds that used these.

Cheers
TonyE

[Steve T]

You weren't to know Tony I emailed jay with the ID......didn't post it here.

Just to confirm we well, the German teller mine fuzes aren't German. They are British copies used for training purposes.

[Battery Command Post]

And bottom right looks like the detonator head of a 2 inch mortar bomb that has had the body rotted away, but still has safety transit cap in place.

Hi Gary, the thing bottom right is a cap with a metal tail... but its completely empty its too small to be anything inch related.

The cap with a metal tail is the safety cap from 117, 119 and 213 Fuzes (and probably others). These were the standard fuzes for the 25-Pr HE round. The cap protected the Direct Action striker, but with the 119 Fuze, the shell could be fired 'cap on' to turn it into a graze action fuze.

Here is a picture:



Rob

[big ned]

DM



The wheel thingy looks like it is off an American mine.

That's right, it's the det plate off either a M1 anti tank mine or the almost identical M1 A1 or M4 type I believe.

[Battery Command Post]

I was simply using 18Pr and 25 Pr as examples of the sort of fixed rounds that used these.

Not trying to pick on you but the 25-Pr didn't use a fixed round, it used variable non-fixed ammunition.

Rob