Pre D Day battleground Training Area.

[LUCKYSTRIKE]

I've cleaned up a few more of the recent finds from the site.

First up is a BESA 7.92 case the only one Ive found here. Notice the rusted clip the .303 and 30 cal are just for scale.



This view shows the other side of the clip and close up of the markings.



I've now cleaned the end of the British 2 inch smoke mortar.



A few very relic relics here, the top is a US 2.36 Bazooka mk1 motor tube with bent tail fins. Bottom left a fired US M9 rifle Grenade tail and right a British 2 inch smoke/para illum tail which is very light perhaps zinc or an alloy, Ive only found steel ones in this shape before so thought it worth posting.



Inert used US smoke M15 grenade fuze with two spoons found close by.



Inert used US Mark 11A1 (Pineapple) grenade fuze.



Now here's a question, would you bother to keep this if you'd found it ? It was covered in slimy mud I could see no details but it felt like a fin and slightly larger than a 2 inch mortar. Anyway I nearly didnt bother cleaning it when I got home, but Im pleased I did. Is that traces of paint ......












I turned it over and would you believe, it was like it had been specially cut out to retain all the markings from a British NO68 anti tank rifle grenade. Is that luck or what



A selection of bits, another US 30 cal Granade clip, three US M1 Carbine used cases, these are quite scarce from this site. One 6 mil case and a very red .303 case. I often find them with red tops but haven't seen one like this where its nearly completely covered. The other one is just to show a standard one for contrast.



A couple of very relic brass fuzes, you can see from the .303 one was quite a biggy.



A few relic fins and the tail from US 60mm M49A2 mortars.



Yet more relic fins and tails, this time from US 81mm M43A1 mortars.



Oh here's another one of these questions..... would you have kept this if you'd found it?

I could see no markings and there are loads of shot gun cartridge bases at this site. But I dont know why, it sort of felt different so it went in the finds bag....










Pleased I did because when I cleaned it up this was revealed WRA Winchester Repeating Arms 81mm M3. It's the base of a cartridge that fired a US M43A1 mortar



and finally for this time.... a larger exploded shell casing this is the second from this site both were found quite close to each other and both where blown apart like this. British 40mm Bofors? or is that 2 pounder?



Cheers.
LS

[TonyE]

2 Pr. anti-tank gun

Cheers
TonyE

[LUCKYSTRIKE]

Excellent news
Thanks Tony

[Steve T]

Nice 2lber and that grenade frag is just superb. Just goes to show........take EVERYTHING home!

Attached is a pic of a BESA belt for reference

[LUCKYSTRIKE]

Hi Steve,
Thanks mate, the pic confirms the clip, it's a robust beast covering about 25% of the cartridge.
All the Best.
LS

[spotter]

The id of the grenade parts been from M15 smokes is incorrect,The mechanism shown is Striker mechanism no2 or no3 the same as that used on British/commonwealth grenades such as the No80 WP grenade and No83 smoke , ive not seen one with the top of the grenade body raised as in your example and im tending to think that its the No80 a bursting WP grenade and the deformation/raising has been caused when the grenade body expanded on detonation,,, i have attached an image of both the M15 and The No80 so you can see the differences

note the images of the No80 are not mine and i found by googling

[TonyE]

Luckystrike - A couple of questions about the cartridge cases you showed in your last post.

What is the headstamp of the red coloured .303 inch blank? There is no official colour coding like that. The fired blanks you mention with the red tip could be H Mark 4 Grenade Dischargers for launching the No.85 grenade (American M9A1).

What is the headstamp on the pistol cartridge you called "6 mil"? It looks like it could be a 7.65mm French Long.

Thanks,
TonyE

[LUCKYSTRIKE]

Hi Spotter,
Thank you for the id and pictures, I'd assumed it was US because all the other finds from that area were all US relics. But I can see what you mean it does look like a Brit No 80 or 83. I like the explaination for the damage its suffered .
All the Best.
LS

[LUCKYSTRIKE]

Hi Tony,
The cartridges with the red painted tops are all .303 blanks, I'm thinking that the odd one I posted was probably one of these that had been excessively painted in error. It is unmarked on the base which seems to be a fairly common for the blank cases.



I've cleaned the 6 mil base up because it was hard to make out the markings, as you can see it says 6 M M with G.F.L. as the maker. I've just looked the maker up and was surprised to see its Italian? Giulio Fiocchi of Lecco, Italy. As there's no date shown perhaps its post war although the corrosion and dirt confirmed many years burial.



Thank You.
LS

[TonyE]

Thanks for the nice clear pictures.

I am not convinced that the red on the .303 blank case is intentional rather than just the way the copper has reacted with the soil. As i said earlier, there is no official marking of blanks with red paint/lacquer other than a red sealant on the tips of some H Mark 4 Discharger cartridges. Ordinary Blank L Mark V were never marked liked that. As you say, it is not unuaual to find blanks with no headstamps, although it was more common post war with the L Mark 9z.

I am surprised about the GFL blank. You are quite correct about the manufacturer and the 6mm was only ever made as a civilian blank (or possibly a tear gas cartridge, it is outside my range of interest). I would not expect to find it in a military dump. I will try to find out more.

Thanks again,
TonyE