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A couple of Butcher bayonets

Article about: Here are a couple of butchers I have, an s98/05 neuer Art and an s98/05 neuer Art mit Sage. The sawback has an ersatz frog that I thought was German at 1st, but the rivets are wrong. Most li

  1. #11

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    Awesome. I love the Butcher bayonets. Have a few, but no sawbacks.

  2. #12

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    Sorry----just had to add a picture
    Click to enlarge the picture Click to enlarge the picture Click image for larger version. 

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    gregM
    Live to ride -- Ride to live

    I was addicted to the "Hokey-Pokey" but I've turned
    myself around.

  3. #13
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    Great picture Greg!

    Jim

  4. #14

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    Thanks
    gregM
    Live to ride -- Ride to live

    I was addicted to the "Hokey-Pokey" but I've turned
    myself around.

  5. #15

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    Quote by Chopperman View Post
    Sorry----just had to add a picture
    Greg do you feel that? That's me tapping the area where the like button used to be

    Regards,

    Lance

  6. #16

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    Thanks Lance
    gregM
    Live to ride -- Ride to live

    I was addicted to the "Hokey-Pokey" but I've turned
    myself around.

  7. #17
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    Hi Jim-

    Nice bayonets. The one with the numbered crossguard is interesting. I think Bavarians sometimes put accountability numbers on crossguards during the war too. Odd that the numbers are on yours are facing the right way when the point of the blade is up, don't ever recall seeing that on a German bayonet. Maybe it was used post war by a foreign country? The frog may be non-German, the bottom rivets on the frog aren't typically German, neither is the double row of stitching on the pocket. Of course variations existed, so maybe it is German, just not typical.

    -Tim

  8. #18
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    Hello Tim and welcome to the forum!

    Frogs from the period can be confusing for me when they are unmarked. So many countries used the 98/05 after the war and some made their own frogs. Throw in the fact that there were so many different manufacturers and changes toward the end of the war, it can sometimes be hard to no if one is period or not. That is why I like them marked and dated, when I can find them!

    As far as the numbers on the cross guard, it is my understanding that accountability numbers, and/ or rack numbers, on Bavarian police sidearms were on the obverse for a time due to unit markings on the reverse. Things changed pretty regularly in the post war years, so anything is possible. It is also possible that it could be a serial number from another country using it postwar, but being that the only modification is the scabbard being painted black, I tend to lean to the Bavarian connection. But, honestly there is no absolute way to know for sure to my knowledge.

    Regards,
    Jim

  9. #19
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    Hi Jim,

    The thing I noticed about the numbers wasn't that they were on the obverse vs. the reverse, but rather that they are upside down. I took a look in one of Roy Williams books and there are several examples with numbers both upside down and right side up, so that's not necessarily a clue. I did find a picture of a Fitchtel and Sachs with a 4 digit number in the same orientation as yours, but stamped on the reverse side.

    Neat piece, the numbers and the frog add a little mystery.

    Tim

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