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unknown German? cartridge box

Article about: Greetings, I have a cartridge box that I bought years ago, since then I have been trying to found out to what it belongs to. It reminds me a bit of an Enfield cartridge box, but I don't thin

  1. #1

    Default unknown German? cartridge box

    Greetings,

    I have a cartridge box that I bought years ago, since then I
    have been trying to found out to what it belongs to.

    It reminds me a bit of an Enfield cartridge box, but I don't think it is.

    The cavalry insignia was on the box when I bought it.
    I don't know if this insignia is original to the box.

    This piece reminds me a bit of an Enfield cartridge box,
    but I strongly do not believe that this piece is one.

    The box was bought in Germany, this doesn't make it
    German, but it is a start.

    Thank you to all
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    Last edited by skippyroo1; 11-13-2012 at 11:58 AM.

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  3. #2

    Default Re: unknown German? cartridge box

    Skip, not German, from any period I am afraid, especially from the 1896 Imperial period.....I thought at first that the "Crossed Swords" device might be a later addition, as it is a "Bundeswehr" (modern German armed forces) Army motif (1955 to present)....but I have several, although similar (see photograph), not one is exact to one on your pouch !...But I would imagine the sword motif is not confined to the Bundeswehr ! Lets see if any others can chip in with a positive I.D.
    Prost ! Steve.
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    "The German Army is the perfectly adapted, perfectly running Machine. The difference is that the Germans are organised with a view to War...with the cold, hard, practical and business-like purpose of winning victories."
    G.W. Steevens - The Daily Mail (1897)

  4. #3

    Default Re: unknown German? cartridge box

    Thank you oradour, the pouch is definably imperial era. I found two pouches on the German Google site that were on sale. They were exactly the same as mine with F.A. 1896 the numbers were of cause different.
    One pouch though had crossed rifles instead of the crossed swords as mine. The other
    pouch was missing the insignia but a hole was visible were one was once attached. Unfortunately the
    pouches on sale were completely without any description.

    I could not found out anything from the sellers, as they didn't know what is was themselves.

    Who knows if this is the original insignia to this pouch, I don't believe it is. It is screwed to the back of the front flap,
    I don't believe Imperial era had this type of attachment. But I could be wrong.

    I thank you for your input.

    P.S. I have the saber posted with three other insignias that I cannot put to date, there you can see the back of it

  5. #4

    Default Re: unknown German? cartridge box

    I most probably have a poor recollection on this one but that brass cross swords badge looks to be the same as the one i used to have on a WEST GERMAN SKI CAP.Unfortunatly i no longer have it to compare but i'm 99% sure it was the same.

  6. #5

    Default Re: unknown German? cartridge box

    Quote by FALLSCHIRMJAGER View Post
    I most probably have a poor recollection on this one but that brass cross swords badge looks to be the same as the one i used to have on a WEST GERMAN SKI CAP.Unfortunatly i no longer have it to compare but i'm 99% sure it was the same.
    Have you not read post #2 ? the badge shown there is off the BW M43/ski style cap ! it is not the same....
    Skip...it is not Imperial German, believe me, if it was I would be able to I.D. the model of pouch, it is nothing like any known Imperial German ammunition pouch or come to think of it, any Imperial pouch ! the markings IMO are not Imperial either...the "Crossed Swords" mtif was not to my knowledge used in that time either......
    Prost ! Steve.
    "The German Army is the perfectly adapted, perfectly running Machine. The difference is that the Germans are organised with a view to War...with the cold, hard, practical and business-like purpose of winning victories."
    G.W. Steevens - The Daily Mail (1897)

  7. #6

    Default Re: unknown German? cartridge box

    http://www.agmohio.com/LR1886equipment.htm
    It's similar to the Model 1886 Front Cartridge Box on this page, the belt loops are slightly different but the rest of it looks the same. no crossed swords though, designed for use with the Remington Rolling Block rifle.
    It's a wasted trip baby. Nobody said nothing about locking horns with no Tigers.



    I'm Spartacus, not really i'm Paul!...

  8. #7

    Default Re: unknown German? cartridge box

    oradour, thanks, I should refraise myself. When I meant Imperial German, I meant to say out of this era not knowing from which country. I too, in my research did not find any pouches similar, connected with the German army. I agree with you 100% that this is not German. I apologize for my misleading text. The fact that two were sold in Germany does of cause not mean that they are.

    The problem with some military items is that a lot of them are not for example mass-production some could have been new introduced test models that were never fully excepted and so on. I tried to put this in consideration too.

    Maybe Gunny Hartmann is on to something. It does look similar on the site he suggested.

  9. #8

    Default Re: unknown German? cartridge box

    Greetings Gunny Hartmann,

    I took the time to look at the site you suggested to me, thank you for your info.
    I'm now a bit closer to solve this issue with this pouch, but I'm also becoming more
    confused. Even though the box on the site you gave me is very close to mine it is
    not close enough to solve the mystery.

    The pouch "no. 3" on your site is for an Infantry regulations of 1886 introduced a new set
    of accoutrements for the Remington Rolling Block rifle for the Spanish military
    stationed in the Philippines.

    I searched further on the same site and I came across another pouch that
    looks closer to mine "No. 2". But still with big differences. These 1886 cartridge pouch
    and boxes were altered or newly manufactured for the Mauser rifle. Again, for
    the Spanish military stationed in the Philippines.

    The sizes of the pouches of 2 and 3 are more rectangular than my pouch "no.1".
    "No.2" has the deeper cut out and has almost the same grooving pattern as mine no.1.
    And none of them carry any markings on the back as mine does. My pouch compared
    to the other two from size seams to be more of a pistol pouch.

    Even with this new information I still could not find a pouch that fits mine. But
    all seams to lead, at this moment that my pouch could be a Spanish model.

    I have posted all three models to compere, the first one being mine.

    I know that some countries "stole" accoutrement models from other countries,
    modified them for there own usage and claimed them then, to be there's.

    Thanks to your help I am getting a bit closer.
    Thank you again.
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  10. #9

    Default Re: unknown German? cartridge box

    No problem, i'm glad to have been of some help. I hope you solve your mystery.
    It's a wasted trip baby. Nobody said nothing about locking horns with no Tigers.



    I'm Spartacus, not really i'm Paul!...

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