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FAKE ? and STALINGRAD ?

Article about: Hi all, I am new to this forum... so first and foremost hi guys ! I would really appreciate your thoughts on the below 3 dog tags. I have a couple of questions... 1) Are they genuine or fake

  1. #1
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    Default FAKE ? and STALINGRAD ?

    Hi all,

    I am new to this forum... so first and foremost hi guys !

    I would really appreciate your thoughts on the below 3 dog tags. I have a couple of questions...

    1) Are they genuine or fake ?
    2) The owner claims that all 3 were dug up at German positions in Stalingrad, thus implyign all 3 units fought at the battle. I have looked on the net and cannot see any documentation to support this. Any thoughts ?

    I would really appreciate your help.

    Thanks

    Oz
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  3. #2

    Default Re: FAKE ? and STALINGRAD ?

    I think they are good. Firstly they are all Ersatz (replacement) units so not particulary rare. Fonts look good and I can't see any evidence of post war stamping of old blanks.

    The first one is 3rd Kompany, motorized Infantry replacement battailon 156 which was used in the resupply of Infantry Division 16, part of which fought in Stalingrad.

    The second one is 4th Komapnie, Infantry Replacement Battailon 346 but a link to any Stalingrad units I couldn't easily come across however having said that, as an Ersatz unit the soldier could have been posted far and wide.

    The third one is 3rd Light Artillery Replacement Detachment 262 which fell under Artillery Regiment 83 which was under the 100th Rifle Division reported as destroyed at Stalingrad in January 1943.

    So theres my pennies worth... hopefully some more knowledgable members will be along to confirm or deny my observations.

    Cheers
    Glenn

  4. #3
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    Default Re: FAKE ? and STALINGRAD ?

    Thanks for your comments Glenn.... really appreciated. Items like this becoem so much more meaningful once you can out a 'face' to it so to speak. Cheers.

  5. #4

    Default Re: FAKE ? and STALINGRAD ?

    You're welcome Oz, I'm no expert but I've learnt a little about these things since joining the forum, hopefully Matt will be along soon enough to put his stamp of authority on your items.

    Can I ask what the seller is asking for these items? As I say they aren't rare or exotic units and sometimes sellers like to trade on the 'Stalingrad' aura to try and command a silly price.

    Glenn

  6. #5
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    Default Re: FAKE ? and STALINGRAD ?

    Of course Glenn, he is asking between 55-65 USD for each of them. I think it is a little overpriced given the fact that they are from replacement units, however I do (like most people) have a draw to Stalingrad so i was tempted.

    In fact... he is selling another unusual item which i have listed in the "belts, buckles" forum (as i wan't sure where to post it). I have NEVER come across such an item before and was a little mindful of it.... it is a "Permit to fly" out of the Stalingrad pocket..... have a look mate.... I have honestly never heard of it before and cannot find any record or documentation confirming the existence of it..... but it sounds such a fantastic story !

  7. #6

    Default Re: FAKE ? and STALINGRAD ?

    I think $55-65 would be top dollar for these but they are nice, have history and of course "are from Stalingrad" so if you like them, buy them!

    If they are your first Stalingrad Erkennungsmarken i'd advise not to rush in as there were around 300,000 of these lost in the city and these won't be the last to be dug out but as I say if you like them, do it.

    I'll have a look at your permit in the other thread.

  8. #7
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    Default Re: FAKE ? and STALINGRAD ?

    Welcome to the forum Ozmen Glenn's got it all right- and you can find all this using the Lexikon der Wehrmacht site linked to in the 'sticky' at the beginning of this very forum

    Indeed IEB 346 has no obvious link to any units that fought in Stalingrad, however the associations mentioned are only ideals and men did often just go where there was need; the next level of association was within the Wehrkreis, so since he probably didn't go to IR 346 since it was at Leningrad, not Stalingrad, he may have gone to one of the other IRs in Wehrkreis I, of which there were likely a good number.

    They're not overpriced because they're replacement units but rather that they're the most common sort- Infanterie/Grenadier and Artillerie. Glenn's also right that Stalingrad discs aren't rare at all- I bought my first 10 years ago or more, when they first started showing up and there'll probably never be a lack of them. These are in reasonably good shape, are likely all issued and information about their history can be discerned, all of which makes them more valuable than the average disc to be sure, but those prices do seem on the high side. I don't know what Stalingrad discs regularly go for these days though- I got my 5 or 6 a long time ago and I don't bother keeping up anymore- so they may be mainly in the $50 range. I recall I paid $40 for my first one- a Panzerjäger, so inherently a bit more valuable than an Infanterie. It can't hurt to wait though- there'll always be others and a good percentage of the time you can trace the units easily enough.
    Ohhhhh- pillage then burn...

  9. #8
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    Default Re: FAKE ? and STALINGRAD ?

    Matt hi and thankyou so much... i will have a look in the "sticky" section.... i did in the first instance consult your link on fake fonts, but you know, all of these looked like all of the ones i was lookign at buying in soem shape or form.... when you are suspicious you cna always find fault !

    I appreciate your comments and knowledge, like I said to Glenn.... it makes things so much more meaningful when you can piece together the story.
    I managed to pick up the 3rd Light Artillery Replacement Detachment 262 for 45 US$.

  10. #9
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    Default Re: FAKE ? and STALINGRAD ?

    That's a decent price I think these days. And the Lexikon site can give you the details of this and the likely field units involved (Google translator does an okay job if you don't have any German); if something doesn't make sense, just ask and we can clarify.
    Ohhhhh- pillage then burn...

  11. #10

    Default Re: FAKE ? and STALINGRAD ?

    Quote by Matt L View Post
    That's a decent price I think these days. And the Lexikon site can give you the details of this and the likely field units involved (Google translator does an okay job if you don't have any German); if something doesn't make sense, just ask and we can clarify.
    the second dog tag it is in my heand right now i buy this dog tag from volgograd I BIDIT ON E BAY
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