WWI German Aircraft Cockpit Section - Downed In France

**Steven M** · 08-21-2009, 05:50 PM

Hi guys,

Thanks for the interests. I originally posted before in my other thread that this was from a Fokker D. VII as oradour stated, however I have swayed a bit from that theory after some further research. I found original drawings for that particular aircraft and I am having doubts because of the forward portion configuration. This might prove a bit more difficult to identify than I had originally thought. I am exploring the possibilities of this being from an Aviatik B series plane, but I am not 100% on that right now. What I do know for sure is that is is original, it is of German construction and that the shade of blue was in fact applied to German aircraft. I will find my plane, it just may take a while...

**Steven M** · 12-16-2009, 05:22 AM

I would be most appreciative if anyone has any ideas on the type of plane this is from. I have expended my avenues of approach in trying to identify. I have searched for aircraft types of the aerodromes near Noviant at the time and searched for this color pattern as well. I thought that I was on to something relating to the shade of blue used as Rudolph Berthold was known to have the fuselages of aircraft under his command painted this shade AND he was in command of an aerodrome near this sector...just not at the right time.

It does indeed strongly resemble a Fokker configuration, however, the lack of machine gun cutout on the fore section almost eliminates that possibility. I had explored the early Taube configuration, however, they finish rather flat at the aft section of the cockpit. The only other aircraft type I could find that closely resembles the section is either an Aviatik series or an LVG as shown below. Both are close, but not convincing enough for me. Added to this is the date in which the aircraft was brought down compared to the production years of the aircraft mentioned; they are all very early, before 1916 (my section is from a plane brought down in Sept. of 1918). I suppose my piece could be a hack, a worn out old plane that was used for transporting personnel between airfields and such...I am at a loss on this one.

**Gary Cain** · 12-18-2009, 12:10 AM

Hi Steven,

Extremely cool piece of history!! When I first saw I immediatly thought LVG but when compared with the drawing you show I agree it is close but no cigar. I will look through my stuff as well.

Regardless of what it turns out to be that is exceptionally cool!

Gary

**Steven M** · 12-18-2009, 12:11 AM

by Gary Cain

Hi Steven,

Extremely cool piece of history!! When I first saw I immediatly thought LVG but when compared with the drawing you show I agree it is close but no cigar. I will look through my stuff as well.

Regardless of what it turns out to be that is exceptionally cool!

Gary

Thank you Gary, much appreciated. I REALLY enjoy having this piece beyond words.

**Steven M** · 01-21-2010, 05:03 AM

If any one can direct me to someone who may know the type of aircraft this is from, please put me in contact with them. I have searched through hundreds of photos and drawings, but I am not 100% convinced it is from an Aviatik or LVG, although it very well could be...

**Adler** · 01-21-2010, 09:35 AM

Sorry Steve, I know nothing at all about aviation, but I still think it's a very beautifull and interesting piece to have in your collection...

Adler

**BEAST** · 01-21-2010, 01:34 PM

by Steven M

If any one can direct me to someone who may know the type of aircraft this is from, please put me in contact with them. I have searched through hundreds of photos and drawings, but I am not 100 convinced it is from an Aviatik or LVG, although it very well could be...

Steve,
Have you tried the Air Force museum in Dayton? If I recall correctly Terry Atkins is the curator and he might be able to point you in the right direction. If you can't find his contact info, let me know.

**hawk3370** · 01-21-2010, 03:19 PM

by Steven M

If any one can direct me to someone who may know the type of aircraft this is from, please put me in contact with them. I have searched through hundreds of photos and drawings, but I am not 100 convinced it is from an Aviatik or LVG, although it very well could be...

Steve,
I was leaning towards Luft-Verkehrs Gesellschaft L.V.G. B2 from around 1916 (see attached pic #1) however it is not a direct match. The L.V.G. CII 1915 (pic #3) seems to be closer.

The Fokker D.VII cockpit was more of an oval or tear drop design.
(see attached pic #2).

Sorry couldn't be of more help.

Terry

**Steven M** · 01-21-2010, 11:08 PM

Thanks for the additional postings and suggestions all, it does help indeed. I am beginning to believe that the piece I have came from an aircraft which pre-dates 1917. It is very possible that it was a "hack", that is, a sort of transport taxi between aerodromes. I still think that part of the answer lies in the color of the piece and the proximity to aerodromes where it was downed. However, I have struggled to find information on color schemes used on planes at those sites. I did find that Rudolph Berthold had the fuselages of the aircraft under his command painted this color. but he would have moved on during the time this was brought down.

The Air Force Museum may be my next best step.

@ Erick- Please forward me the contact information.

**Steven M** · 02-19-2010, 03:25 AM

I finally got around to building a display for this piece. I suspended it from the ceiling using some scrap pieces of trim from my room rebuild, some 28 gauge galvanized wire and two brass eyelet screws. Believe it or not, the piece only weighs about 5 pounds. The background wall scheme is a two color, three panel fabric scheme I threw together. Let me know what you think...