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M1 fixed bale with ID!!

Article about: Finally found my best M1 and was able to find some great information about the original owner... I clearly remember buying this lovely helmet, from a wonderful little shop (Collectors Corner

  1. #11
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    I couldn’t agree more with you Ethan.

    I bought this helmet a very long time ago and, with the possible exception of the net, have done nothing to it. As a non-combatant, the presence of a net might seem less likely, as you say Mike, so I may well remove it.

    I fully agree with Rod and Rene, regarding the existence of repro chinstraps in the mid-80s and have absolutely no doubts of its originality.

    Oh, and Blackcat, I did find the information you mentioned, regarding the passing of Pvt. Royster and his wife, though chose not to mention it. After all these years with the helmet in my possession, I regret that I was unable to make any kind of contact with him...

    There were early attempts at de-segregation in the closing stages of WWII, though on a very limited ‘experimental’ scale and among carefully selected units, where trouble or confrontation was considered less likely. The majority of African-American troops, however, tended to be involved in the supply and stores chain, such as the famous and heroic ‘Red Ball Express’.
    I like to think of Mr. Royster in such a role and it would indeed explain the condition of the helmet.

    Interestingly, one of the great General Marshall’s late and post-war studies revealed a large proportion of white soldiers had no problem with the idea of a de-segregated army and, indeed, wondered why African-Americans were withheld from frontline service when so many were willing and equally capable!
    They certainly proved their capabilities, beyond all doubt, in the tank battalions and artillery batteries! Then, of course, there were the Tuskegee men...
    (I was once very privileged to meet Lee ‘Buddy’ Archer. He was admiring my B-10 flight jacket on a display I did at Duxford. I said, ‘I’ll swap it for yours’, to which he replied, ‘I would, but I can’t get it back off my daughter!’ - a lovely man and a true gentleman).

    Thank you all for your kind words and responses, as ever.
    Bob

  2. #12

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    I have been traveling all day to get home and now have a small window of time to look over the helmet for myself. I do like the helmet and the history of the vet who owned it. The heat stamp was bothering me today because the hardware was not added up, the heat stamp is not a 51c but is a 51_ c which would put it in the middle 1943 range. The chinstrap is in question, if it is a black steel and not brass it is post war. Early War time buckles were green and magnetic and changed over to black painted brass and only after the war did they change to black painted steel.

    It’s dinner time and the wife is calling, will be back.


    Marty
    Click to enlarge the picture Click to enlarge the picture M1 fixed bale with ID!!  
    Fortune favors the brave 644th td

  3. #13
    MAP
    MAP is offline
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    We really don't know if the net is or is not original to the helmet, it was just an observation on my part. As long as the net is original, I would leave it as is.
    Last edited by MAP; 10-27-2018 at 03:39 AM.
    "Please", Thank You" and proper manners appreciated

    My greatest fear is that one day I will die and my wife will sell my guns for what I told her I paid for them

    "Don't tell me these are investments if you never intend to sell anything" (Quote: Wife)

  4. #14

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    I agree that the third number on the heat stamp appears to be a '2' (or perhaps a '3').

    My McCord fixed-bale shell was not made much later. Here is a photo of the heat stamp '623C' - Note the '2' is slightly lighter stamped or indented than the other numerals. This is a good clear shot of the stamp but in hand the '2' is definitely harder to see than the others.


    Cheers
    Click to enlarge the picture Click to enlarge the picture M1 fixed bale with ID!!  

  5. #15

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    I would like to apologize to Bob and to Rod, Bob I should have read and remember your first post when you said the liner was a Westinghouse and I posted asking you who the maker was. Rod I did not read your post first, you have a good eye for details and your spotting the third number in the heat stamp is correct. Please except my apology.

    I would like to know if the chinstrap buckle is magnetic. Is the net original to the helmet, who know and you will never know unless a picture surfaces of him wearing the helmet and the net is on the helmet. Both the chinstrap and net could and may have been added later and may be original to the helmet, either way you have a great looking helmet with wonderful history.

    Marty
    Fortune favors the brave 644th td

  6. #16

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    I said my eyes were screwed because it looked black Lol,and they never did black on steel in ww2 but as its olive then yes i made a booboo.the straps fine.........

  7. #17
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    No apologies necessary, Marty!
    I’m glad of the discussion... I’m not overly well-versed with the intricacies of the M1, so it’s great to learn and watch the forensics unfold!

    Well, I searched high and low, but couldn’t find my ACME Roadrunner comedy magnet anywhere, so eventually had to make do with the magnet in my phone cover...
    Not as funny, but it proves what I was hoping for!

    My ancient eyes are screwed too, Rudd, but as Rene and all the other eagle-eyes spotted:
    Click to enlarge the picture Click to enlarge the picture M1 fixed bale with ID!!  

  8. #18

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    I also think there’s no need for apologies, plus marty your dinner is more important especially if it was something nice. the buckle does look blackish in the original pictures, but the picture above makes it look greener.
    I would leave the net on it, for all we know as has been said above, he may well have worked on a supply chain and simply come across one these nets and thought that would look cool on my helmet, let’s face it they were young men. I am very open minded that anything is possible.
    All the best
    Rod

  9. #19

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    Green is good!!!!! This is a helmet I would have in my collection. The RedBall Express was mentioned in an earlier post and a interesting fact is one of the commanding officers of the RBE lived 7 miles from my house, I never had the privilege of meeting him.

    Marty
    Last edited by Tank Destroyer; 10-28-2018 at 07:28 PM.
    Fortune favors the brave 644th td

  10. #20
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    That’s a great pity, Marty...
    So often the way. You get to learn of these veterans, just around the corner, when it’s too late.
    He would have been fascinating to talk to. I’ve always favoured what many would call ‘the mundane’, over all the elite...
    For every frontline soldier, there was something like 18 people keeping him there; fed, clothed, armed, fuelled, equipped...

    All the best and thanks to all for your contributions and advice, as ever,
    Bob

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