ss double decal helmet

[DougB]

I have to go against the grain and say this is not a Q runic decal but a Pocher and a probably reproduction as I suspect is the party shield. The decals in this condition do not appear to have the correct substructure of originals, Pocher or Q and just look like thin repros.

As well the party shield is trying to be a Q party shield but is Pocher orange/red.
There appears to have been decals applied prior to these (look near the base of both shields) as well.

All in all, I would not take it to the bank these are originals, and when decals are in this poor condition an in hand by someone who really knows SS decals is a must for most decals.

[Masonk]

I'm by no means a helmet expert, but based on Doug's comments, could this be a Norwegian reissue? There does appear to be remnants of a previous decal, especially where the SS decal currently resides. The shape of the remnants resemble the thin pointed shape of the Norwegian decal as seen in the photos below.

In addition, the liner rivets are missing the original paint and I noticed in my recent restoration, when using acetone, this area was the first to lose its paint.

Obviously, the liner and chinstrap could have been added after the fact if this was a reissue.

I won't take a stab at the current decals and their authenticity, but they could have been covered by the Norwegian decals and are in fact authentic which could explain their current condition, or placed on after and aged if not authentic.

Again, I'm no expert and am just hypothesizing. In reality, I hope the whole lid is real because it is a beauty!

[Walkwolf]

I do see the old decal outline, but it looks to be a regular size - positioned
lower than what is there now.........
It doesn't seem to be quite as tall and narrow as the Norwegian type,
and on the top right side, you can see the upper edge of the
once lower decal.

[DougB]

The helmet is not a reissue and to see a Pocher decal on a Q is suspect for me as is the decal construction and thickness and other elements to be honest.

I suspect a beat up Heer helmet with the Heer decals removed and reproduction SS and Party decals added and the aged and toolmarked.

[matiu]

Thanks for all your opinions. If you look very closely at the ss decal, it would appear that someone has scratched the runes away. If you look at the runes under an eyeglass you will see pixels. I don't know if that can be right for authentic decals??? also if it is not a Q party shield, then I suppose I would have some suspicions about the whole helmet, which is a shame really as it has a really nice look/feel. I think I will seek further expert opinion on the decals before I consign it to the "fraud" bin. Many thanks to everyone for the input. Steve

[DougB]

If you look very closely at the ss decal, it would appear that someone has scratched the runes away. If you look at the runes under an eyeglass you will see pixels. I don't know if that can be right for authentic decals??? also if it is not a Q party shield, then I suppose I would have some suspicions about the whole helmet, which is a shame really as it has a really nice look/feel. I think I will seek further expert opinion on the decals before I consign it to the "fraud" bin. Many thanks to everyone for the input. Steve

Go ahead and consign it to the fraud bin, never should you see pixels on an SS decal and this is atypical of fakes, damage them enough to destroy the evidence but really all they did was expose this one further, exposing the construction and thickness.

[matiu]

Thanks Doug. Even though I don't want to hear what you are saying...I tend to agree with you. I have had warning bells with this helmet for some time. You just have to be so careful with ANY SS stuff.

Thanks again. All painful lessons are good ones.

Steve

[DougB]

Hi Steve, we all have been there trust me! If you want an in hand evaluation I would be happy to give it a hands on and also magnify the decals to 400x. This will tell the tale with no questions asked.

For example here is an unapplied fake SS decal shown at 20x magnification. At 20x you can see pixelation in the border however some gentle scrubbing can mask this.

At 400x pixelation from an inkjet printer is clearly evident and cannot be hidden.

The pulver is also quite incorrect at 400x magnification and there is no cellulose substructure that is always on authentic SS decals.

Science and knowledge databasing are getting to the point where fakes can run but they cannot hide anymore.

[matiu]

Thanks Doug

As I said, with an eyeglass you can see the pixels in the ss rune. Good to see that Science can help with this.

I appreciate the offer of a hands on look, but I think I know that these decals arn't right. I live in England and Canada may be too far away. I would like to post another single decal M42 , and if you would be kind enough to cast your eye over the helmet and decal, I would appreciate it.

Thanks

Steve

[DougB]

Thanks Doug

As I said, with an eyeglass you can see the pixels in the ss rune. Good to see that Science can help with this.

I appreciate the offer of a hands on look, but I think I know that these decals arn't right. I live in England and Canada may be too far away. I would like to post another single decal M42 , and if you would be kind enough to cast your eye over the helmet and decal, I would appreciate it.

Thanks

Steve

Anytime Steve. I get sent helmets for evaluations from all over the world so it is not a problem for a hands on but I understand.
Post away!
Cheers
Doug