ss m42 helmet

**Wagriff** · 07-27-2013, 08:20 PM

Lordy...if the fakers would put half the effort they put into the aging, faking and detailing of their products, and instead, put it into something Good, they would be on the top of any trade you could think of...but, no-instead they choose to toil and scheme just to make the Perfect undetectable fake so they can garner in thousands of stolen dollars with impunity... What a hobby....

**Espenlaub Militaria** · 07-27-2013 08:20 PM

We also buy and trade your items and full collections!

**SSamir** · 07-27-2013, 08:24 PM

Fakers went as far as applying decals on SS helmets that had their decals either period removed due to regulations, or due to post war denazification, and IMO, this helmet happens to be one of them.

I respect your opinion. If you feel this is real, then go buy it, your money. I can't tell people what to do with their money, I can only offer them my honest opinion. I collect SS helmets only. It's the only thing I know, and the only thing I study in this hobby. Again, i'm no expert, but i'm no fool either. I know my SS decals (most), and this one is just not one of them.

You say prove you wrong? No problem. Ship me this helmet, and I will point out all the flaws by using an ADM scope. I will display two photos of each. A set of for this one, and a set of genuine ones for comparison, both magnified at 20X, and 200X.

Regards
Samir

**FALLSCHIRMJAGER** · 07-27-2013, 10:53 PM

by SSamir

Fakers went as far as applying decals on SS helmets that had their decals either period removed, or removed due to post war denazification, and IMO, this helmet happens to be one of them.

I respect your opinion. If you feel this is real, then go buy it, your money. I can't tell people what to do with their money, I can only offer them my honest opinion. I collect SS helmets only. It's the only thing I know, and the only thing I study in this hobby. Again, i'm no expert, but i'm no fool either. I know my SS decals (most), and this one is just not one of them.

You say prove you wrong? No problem. Ship me this helmet, and I will point out all the flaws by using an ADM scope. I will display two photos of each. A set of for this one, and a set of genuine ones for comparison, both magnified at 20X, and 200X.

Regards
Samir

I am no great expert in handling "genuine" SS decals but I still stand by my original opinion. Why oh Why did Pocher suddenly fail in there printing methods?? I personally would not touch this decal !! I may miss out on a good one here and there but better that than sit on a "QUESTIONABLE"one in the EXPENSIVE POT!! Leon.

**Brian** · 07-28-2013, 12:37 AM

by SSamir

Fakers went as far as applying decals on SS helmets that had their decals either period removed due to regulations, or due to post war denazification, and IMO, this helmet happens to be one of them.

I respect your opinion. If you feel this is real, then go buy it, your money. I can't tell people what to do with their money, I can only offer them my honest opinion. I collect SS helmets only. It's the only thing I know, and the only thing I study in this hobby. Again, i'm no expert, but i'm no fool either. I know my SS decals (most), and this one is just not one of them.

You say prove you wrong? No problem. Ship me this helmet, and I will point out all the flaws by using an ADM scope. I will display two photos of each. A set of for this one, and a set of genuine ones for comparison, both magnified at 20X, and 200X.

Regards
Samir

No, I will not buy this helmet because I respect your opinion. The hobby is in dire need of specialists such as yourself who are into the intimate details.
The idea that this helmet could be a former de-nazified SS helmet that had received a fake SS decal in the postwar years is interesting, and an idea that I don't believe you had mentioned previously. Certainly SS decals (real and fake) have been postwar applied to nearly every type of WWII German helmet. I have been casting suspicions on some (champagne) over the years.

As I am not an SS decal expert, I can't say I see any glaring graphic inconsistencies beyond what some have termed 'printing run variations'. Is it possible that this decal is a printing run variation that is yet unknown? Also, is there any evidence whatsoever that a former decal had been scraped off?

**SSamir** · 07-28-2013, 01:00 AM

by Brian

No, I will not buy this helmet because I respect your opinion. The hobby is in dire need of specialists such as yourself who are into the intimate details.
The idea that this helmet could be a former de-nazified SS helmet that had received a fake SS decal in the postwar years is interesting, and an idea that I don't believe you had mentioned previously. Certainly SS decals (real and fake) have been postwar applied to nearly every type of WWII German helmet. I have been casting suspicions on some (champagne) over the years.

As I am not an SS decal expert, I can't say I see any glaring graphic inconsistencies beyond what some have termed 'printing run variations'. Is it possible that this decal is a printing run variation that is yet unknown? Also, is there any evidence whatsoever that a former decal had been scraped off?

LOL! Again, I wish I was an expert, but I will take that as a compliment, thank you.

You don't have to buy the helmet, sometimes collectors are willing to ship their helmets out for in hand examinations.

Champagne type decals are actually a challenge for me. I have never owned one. I have physically seen some examples from respected collections, but never got to examine them.

This ones no printing variation, and I can't see by the pics provided that there was a former decal applied, probably buried by this decal.

Wish Doug was here, highly doubt this thread would have dragged on this far, but I had fun. =)

Regards
Samir

**FALLSCHIRMJAGER** · 07-28-2013, 01:01 AM

Hi Brian & SSAMIR , not that my thoughts really amount to a "hill of beans" to you guys who handle and study these SS decals/ lids, to the extreme,but I still feel myself that I would not be happy with a helmet that had these "questions" hanging over it. If I as a novice I feel uncomfortable with this decal , how much tougher is it to convince the experts that this "print variation" is correct? To me it is no different to trying to say that an S&L FALLSCHIRMSHUTZABZEICHEN ,scrape on a pin is period or post war! There is no proof apart from what we know is correct,some are some are not! For me this decal is NOT correct,i have not seen any corresponding period pieces(personally) . I'm not trying to be naughty, just my opinion.

Leon.

**SSamir** · 07-28-2013, 01:25 AM

by FALLSCHIRMJAGER

Hi Brian & SSAMIR , not that my thoughts really amount to a "hill of beans" to you guys who handle and study these SS decals/ lids, to the extreme,but I still feel myself that I would not be happy with a helmet that had these "questions" hanging over it. If I as a novice I feel uncomfortable with this decal , how much tougher is it to convince the experts that this "print variation" is correct? To me it is no different to trying to say that an S&L FALLSCHIRMSHUTZABZEICHEN ,scrape on a pin is period or post war! There is no proof apart from what we know is correct,some are some are not! For me this decal is NOT correct,i have not seen any corresponding period pieces(personally) . I'm not trying to be naughty, just my opinion.

Leon.

Leon, your inputs are always welcomed, and I don't blame you for not wanting this one in your collection. You don't want your money tied up in something that will be later questioned when you try and sell it, especially if you were in a desperate situation to sell, because of some emergency. There are great textbook examples out there. Textbook examples may not come cheap, but you won't have a problem selling it when you do need it sold. =)

Regards
samir

**FALLSCHIRMJAGER** · 07-28-2013, 01:32 AM

Hence I'm happy with my "bog standard" ET single decal M42!! Leon.

**Brian** · 07-28-2013, 01:54 AM

by SSamir

There's a few more flaws this decal has I rather not disclose as fakers roam the forums to learn from their errors.

I would say this decal would fool 95% of collectors easy, as it is a close match to the Ken N. Pocher decal. And if they were told the decal was fake, they would still not know exactly why.
So you have lets say 95% of collectors who would fall for this, and 5% experts and SS decal enthusiasts who could spot it as fake.

If the specific graphic anomalies that makes this decal a fake were posted here, then the 5% of collectors who could spot the decal as fake could potentially rise to 100%.

If collectors know what to look for, they will reject these helmets and the circulation of fake helmets will greatly decrease.

Yes, fakers will realize collectors are catching on and make even better fakes, but that is why we have experts and enthusiasts, to catch the fakes as they begin to circulate.

**SSamir** · 07-28-2013, 02:07 AM

Collectors today are catchin on to the forums, thus making it harder for the fakers to catch potential victims, such as the OP for instance. There will always be fakers out there, because not every collector bothers to even learn the decals. There's lots of collectors out there willing to educate others. Just simply post on the forum. Usually there's Doug, but he's away on vacation, Kelly sometimes drops by, and we have lots more such as Frank from GHW, Foamspoon, PeterB, Gisle, Walter, and lots more! I myself get PM's all the time asking for help, and I do try it if I could, but collectors have to commit to learning as well. Experience collectors are not always around.

Regards
Samir