Battlefields in North Karelia( SS-Nord Division)

[Paul D]

OP, thank you so much for your pictures. It is so jaw-dropping and emotional to see such an excellent array of artifacts.

I do need to say that I am utterly horrified that many of these artifacts are dug up and sold off like pieces of insignificant meat. I wouldn't go as far as some here and call you a grave-robber, but I do find it a bit unnerving to disturb these areas and profit off fallen soldiers. Areas this rich in artifacts, in my humble opinion, should be marked as sacred plots and properly researched by archaeological authorities. Unlike amateur digger/collectors, professional archaeologists use the scientific method to not only document such finds, but try to create a greater picture of the events that occurred. I can totally understand metal-detecting in parts of Stalingrad, or Omaha Beach, etc and collecting random shell casings, or patches, or cups etc.. but these dig sites seem extremely rich with history and should be preserved, not prostituted off to greedy collectors. It's too bad (though I'm not surprised in the least) that a country like Russia does not preserve these lands for professional investigation.

That being said, I respect you Mr. OP. In fact, I would probably be doing the same thing you are if I had these sites near me (and it was legal to dig). As a lifelong student of history and a WWII fanatic, I would be in my element digging and discovering such beautiful relics. I am not perfect by any means and understand 100% why you do this, but if I were doing this, the last thing I would do is sell them off. If I had to get rid of them, I would donate them to a museum. Morally, I couldn't live with myself to profit off the dead. But you can and I totally understand why, so please don't think I'm trying to disrepect you.

I know I am in the vast minority with this view, especially on a website dedicated to digging and selling relics, but I just wanted to say my point. Good luck in your digging and profiteering.

My heart goes out to the fallen Russian and German soldiers. May they rest in peace.

Respectfully and with no animosity whatsoever,
Drewski Von Yankee-Dweller

Not again !!! Have you read the whole thread or the other similar threads on this forum ? I'm sick to the back teeth of people like you coming here and with your first post ranting on about grave robbers etc etc .i have posted quite a few times as have others the reasons why this work is done and the manner in which it is done , the bottom line is that these guys are affiliated to both the German and Russian War graves who seem to have no problem at all with these "amatuers" , trust me the professional archaeologists wouldn't go anywhere near some of these remote tick and mossie infected locations as it would be far too much hard work.

I have also posted that i will not tolerate posts such as yours , it has all been done and discussed before many times and the time where any of these guys need to explain themselves has long gone , your end statement gives you away my friend " Respectfully and with no animosity whatsoever " , when clearly you post this knowing full well that your intention is to stir up problems and a negative discussions.

If this is all you have joined this forum for then maybe you should move on !! This is the first time i have not welcomed a new member but enough is enough !!

I would ask that other members waste no more of their time answering posts like this.

[Wagriff]

One point, however, should be made...when you(Diggity) talk of "profiting from the dead", who says that all of these artifacts were From the dead? The SS Regiment wasn't wiped out to a man, afterall. Actually, a great proportion of these items are simply ground dug finds-period. By this reasoning of yours, Any item from Any battlefield should "donated to a museum". Does this apply to Roman? Ancient Greek? Native American arrowheads? You can carry this to as absurd as you wish. These diggers put themselves in great personal danger every time they stick a shovel into the ground. No one knows if the next thing it touches will be an unexploded bomb,artillery shell or who Knows what. If you've actually read through the thread, you'll see that they Do encounter a great Deal of still deadly ordinance. And you think it's all for a few lousy dollars to strip some imaginary dead body of it's belt buckle? People Really need to Think before they post such asinine statements...(Sorry,Paul...I just thought it pertinent to mention this))

[Glenn66]

Now, back to our regular program?

[Datrus]

Now, back to our regular program?

Yes, but one thing. If good diggers like Seb, me and others did not do what we do, the items would stay in the ground and/or be in the hands of soulless diggers. We sell some of our items to sponsor our interest in recovering pieces of history.
Seb digs mostly in "dump sites". Karel Gott do good work. That was my 2 cents on this. Sorry but i had to do it.

Regards, Lars

[DiggityDiggity]

Not again !!!

Well, as you can see Paul, this isn't a black and white issue. There are many people that feel uncomfortable with others profiteering in this way.

I worded my response in a way to show that I am not just an internet troll. I am fond of history and love to see discoveries. It just made me a bit uneasy knowing concentrated sites like these weren't being professionally handled.

This isn't a personal attack to anyone that has this hobby. I am not the only one that feels this way. In many sections of the world, relic-digging is forbidden, because it is such a controversial moral issue as well as a danger to those digging.

I am truly (and I mean it) sorry if I offended the OP or other hobbyists here. As stated in my original post (which most have conveniently overlooked), I would probably be doing the same thing if I were in areas like these. My issue is mainly with bureaucratic institutions letting concentrated sites be ravaged. I will continue to browse the fascinating posts here and comment (or not) on various finds you daring people have discovered. I just needed to state this point. I would dishonor myself if I did not.

If you feel you have to delete my membership because I gave my viewpoint, go right ahead. We all know what happens when freedom of speech is taken away. Surely, the Germans in the 30's/40's knew all too well...

Respectfully yours,
The Thorn in Your Side

[KradSpam]

Not again



Bluntly put, you are simply wrong. No grey areas. Lars (Datrus) put it very concisely here.

https://www.warrelics.eu/forum/battl...-we-do-180711/

The people you should direct these opinions at do exist, but you have not found them yet.

[Steve T]

I worded my response in a way to show that I am not just an internet troll.

Odd then that your first post is an attack. Hardly the work of someone other than a troll.....

It just made me a bit uneasy knowing concentrated sites like these weren't being professionally handled.

They are. You seem to have conveniently overlooked that these guys work closely with the authorities to repatriate fallen soldiers of all nationalities. 99% of archaeologists and government agencies are not in the slightest bit interested in our recent history, preferring instead to concentrate on Roman, Medieval and other such eras. If guys like us didn't recover the items, they would be lost forever.

I am truly (and I mean it) sorry if I offended the OP or other hobbyists here. As stated in my original post (which most have conveniently overlooked), I would probably be doing the same thing if I were in areas like these.

What a totally crass statement to make. I do wish you people would read your posts before hitting reply. If you would be doing the same thing, your whole argument is flawed and your point of view open to ridicule.

My issue is mainly with bureaucratic institutions letting concentrated sites be ravaged.

Then go moan at them, not us.

If you feel you have to delete my membership because I gave my viewpoint, go right ahead. We all know what happens when freedom of speech is taken away. Surely, the Germans in the 30's/40's knew all too well...

We wouldn't dream of it. Why give you the satisfaction of being able to say 'I got banned for not agreeing with people'. You are the type of person that seeks out attention through unnecessary provocation. We're used to your type here and will, after this reply, just ignore you. Eventually you will stumble over something else on the net you can have a moan about and bugger off there. Oh wait.....you're not a troll.

The Thorn in Your Side

Believe me when I say that you are nothing of the kind. We see guys like you come and go and, to be honest, tend to feel sad for you more than anything. Thorn in our side ? You honestly think we lie awake at night thinking about you ? How very sad.

Now please, if you're going to have a go at relic hunters in general, go do it in a thread all your own. Don't hijack other people's threads or you will find your comments removed. Start your own thread. Don't ruin this one.

Steve T

[TrondK]

I have just one tiny thing to add...

[DiggityDiggity]

I find it funny that you guys get so upset over someone that respectfully disagrees with you. Instead, you rush to the conclusion that I am a troll and throw insults and ignorance my way. You could engage in an intellectual discussion over the matter but your emotions get the best of you. I think we can clearly see who the real trolls are.

[KradSpam]

I find it funny that you guys get so upset over someone that respectfully disagrees with you. Instead, you rush to the conclusion that I am a troll and throw insults and ignorance my way. You could engage in an intellectual discussion over the matter but your emotions get the best of you. I think we can clearly see who the real trolls are.

Start your own thread.