On Now! Heads up for U.K. Members......

[StefanM]

The archeologist digging the "gas chamber" trench declares that he has found several yellow tiles (approx. 51mins into the film) and also terracotta brown tiles (and brick) which the viewer is then shown:


Above: screen grab from the documentary showing yellow tile glazed front surface.



Above: The reverse of the tile with what the team announce is a "Star of David" design and hence evidence that they have found the original gas chambers of Treblinka II.



Above: The reverse of a terracotta coloured tile with same "Star of David" design with letter "D" to the left also as embossed into the reverse of the yellow tile fragment.



Above: Terracotta brick from same trench.

Not withstanding the teams assumption that the "Star of David" design on the reverse of the tiles must mean it is Jewish and therefore part of the German gas chamber deception to hoodwink the Jews into believing all was well; one of the Treblinka witnesses clearly states that the tiles on the walls of the gas chamber were white. So not yellow tiles as found by the team therefore there is a discrepancy between the witnesses white tiles and the yellow tiles found in the trench which were declared as being proof of having found the original gas chambers. The witness does mention the floor of the gas chamber being brown which could be terracotta of course and the team found this colour tiles/bricks.

The yellow tiles reminded me of another extermination camp photo I had seen from Auschwitz which also featured yellow and brown tiles/bricks and this is that photo below:



A ceramic tiled heating stove at Auschwitz —featuring yellow facing tiles on a terracotta/brown tiled plinth/base.

This is what I think the team found; fragments from a ceramic tiled heating stove—bearing in mind that the site had been repeatedly blown-up, dug-up and sieved through by locals and Soviet militiamen searching for buried Jewish gold in the camp site.

[Adrian]

I'm the first to admit I know absolutely nothing about archaeology but I did wonder about certain things.

They said the level of the ground had been raised since the war and so therefore, wouldn't many of the artifacts found be from this backfill?

Some items were found just a few inches under the surface so I'm fairly sure but will be corrected by our digging colleagues, that again, these items could have been from a spoil heap brought in from who knows where and dumped over the site before being levelled?

The bones found in the woods, was this enough evidence to say it was a mass grave hitherto undiscovered? Or is it likely again to be backfill that contained human remains?

[StefanM]

I'm the first to admit I know absolutely nothing about archaeology but I did wonder about certain things.

They said the level of the ground had been raised since the war and so therefore, wouldn't many of the artifacts found be from this backfill?

Some items were found just a few inches under the surface so I'm fairly sure but will be corrected by our digging colleagues, that again, these items could have been from a spoil heap brought in from who knows where and dumped over the site before being levelled?

The bones found in the woods, was this enough evidence to say it was a mass grave hitherto undiscovered? Or is it likely again to be backfill that contained human remains?

Like you I know nothing about archaeology but the fact that this camp site (as well as others) was extensively plundered begs the question how reliable would any evidence dug up today be. Did the team not know about the "treasure hunters" activities before they started on this project? If they did, how could the team be so sure that the "new" mass graves were as you mention not just the result of backfilling by those engaged in the earlier plunder. Maybe the Polish end of the project did not mention the previous plunder by Poles at Treblinka as this is an extremely contenscious issue for Poles ever since Gross published "Golden Harvest". Unless there was so much more that we did not get to see due to the editing of the footage?

[Adrian]

I guess to the layman it satisfied the requirements of the programme but to me it raised more questions than it answered. I hope some members with archaeological experience can lend their thoughts.

[Scout]

Just when one thought one could not be surprised by the despicable actions of ones fellow 'human beings;'
Digging and blowing up the remains in the post war era - how incredibly callous.
Also astounding, that they thought they'd find any valuables - as if they didnt comprehend what had happened there.

I see the usual Holocaust denial trash have started leaving comments on the C5 website!

Historian Jan Gross recently wrote an extremely contentious book "Golden Harvest" that describes the immediate post-war excavation of Treblinka by local Poles and Soviet soldiers in the hunt for hidden gold amongst the remains of murdered Jews buried in the surrounding former camp environs. The Soviets were even using dynamite in their attempts to bring up the human remains in their pursuit of Jewish gold.

I would have thought this wide scale destruction and despoliation of the site would impact/compromise further archeological investigations?

They do seem to come out in force in such instances.

Ohh, and better keep those tiles away from the public as well. If a bespectaled little nerdy-looking man comes snooping around, it be Fred A. Leuchter trying to get scrape samples.

[StefanM]

Just when one thought one could not be surprised by the despicable actions of ones fellow 'human beings;'
Digging and blowing up the remains in the post war era - how incredibly callous.
Also astounding, that they thought they'd find any valuables - as if they didnt comprehend what had happened there.




They do seem to come out in force in such instances.

Ohh, and better keep those tiles away from the public as well. If a bespectaled little nerdy-looking man comes snooping around, it be Fred A. Leuchter trying to get scrape samples.

There was extremely wide-spread belief or stereotype that all Jews were rich and would therefore have hidden their jewels and gold about or inside their person so it was naturally thought that some of this vast hidden wealth might have survived the murder process and be found in the burial pits given the hundreds of thousands of Jews brought to Treblinka for extermination.

The archeological team did in fact turn up a small jewellery brooch themselves which shows that these objects did survive the murder process, how much more might have been found at Treblinka in 1945?

Look at the plunder of valuables and corruption of the guards and functionaries at Auschwitz during its operation and you have an idea of what riches were available for the unscrupulous and immoral to avail themselves of, which they did.

Illicit digging of the camp sites is still taking place - the draw of Jewish treasures remains a powerful draw even today.

I have seen tile fragments with a similar six pointed star design offered for sale on eBay occasionally, purporting to be "Jewish" tiles from the Warsaw Ghetto or such like. I need to track down this makers mark...my mission over Christmas holidays.


This is the symbol on the tiles

[Gunny Hartmann]

I recorded last nights re-run and have just watched it, i can only say i was pretty underwhelmed by it!....

[Martin Bull]

It was interesting that the programme made no mention of Gitta Sereny's 'Into That Darkness'. For anyone who wants to know more about Treblinka and what happened there, it has to be essential reading.

[CARL]

Dr.Colls and her team have been preparing and working on this study project for several years now, with a further visit to the Treblinka site scheduled for later this year. Reading through the various comments written on the Internet, I consider it a great pity that some have already decided to rubbish their findings when the fact is, the work is far from finished.

[StefanM]

You heard it from me first a year ago !

The tiles found at the Treblinka dig are NOT proof of gas chambers at Treblinka but as I said the "star of David" embossed on the tiles found by the esteemed British forensic archaeologist, Dr. Caroline Sturdy Colls, from Staffordshire University and her colleagues was in fact a Polish tile makers trade mark , as I suggested last year in this thread, and not Jewish at all.... a smug



Above: Tile fragment found by Dr. Colls team at Treblinka.

Read about it here: Smithsonian Red-Faced after



The brand mark of the 125-year old Dziewulski i Lange porcelain factory in Poland. That factory still exists, although it was renamed the Opoczno Terracotta Products Factory in 1950 and is today just called Opoczno S.A.

The company’s symbol is known in the heraldic world as a pierced mullet star, as is not unusual for porcelain marks and coats of arms around Europe.