Hitler Youth Helmet

[John Brandon]

Adrian sorry to differ with you on the liner.I cant believe leather could look that good, and clean after 60 years

That's what is great about this forum, you have have differences of opinion ........................ However on this occasion you are wrong, how many differing styles have you actually handled?

I've had them stone mint, half mint and peppermint. It depends where they were stored why they were stored, and if they were worn at all

why would a helmet like this which was used behind the lines have gotten little use when the citys in germany where in flames in 45.

Ahhh but was it used? ..............you know this for a fact?

I know the style of the liner is consistent with this type of helmet,

Well at last you're learnt something

i would think the hj badge was bad also,lv

Why's that me old son? I'd love to know why you think the HJ badge is bad? And come up with something that hasn't already been said. Now that would be good
I am sorry to bait you, but please, before you start to question probably one of the, if not THE, most respected member on this forum

GET YOUR FACTS STRAIGHT

[LAS VEGAS]

Guys i respect your opinions ,and i hope you respect mine.remember behind the lines helmets where in short supply so they used as you know french ,and russian helmets ect with the added luftskutze decal.why would a perfectly good helmet made for the purpose not get used or little use,and it was better protection than the other foriegn ones in the 45 circumstances.thats my genuine opinion ,and im sticking to it.correct me if im wrong ,but they are making repros of the gladiator style helmet.i have two genuine ones with age consistent with war use ,and decades old.you did try to bate me there ,but im sure ade respects us all as well as himself, and enjoys hearing others opinion,thats i would suggest is what the forum is about.im very suspicious of the helmet because of its mint liner and apearance.this was a basic helmet to be used in tuff circumstances ,not some generals helmet where it rarely left a shelf,surely others see my points as valid,/lv.ps ade wont bite!!!

[helmet2id]

I'm with John and Ade on this one. But for the diamond, it is a 100% period text book one piece gladiator luftschutz, and a very good example of one at that!. Jim G.

[LAS VEGAS]

Helmet 2 id, i respect your opinion,but can you honestly disagree with my points?lv

[John Brandon]

I'm with John and Ade on this one. But for the diamond, it is a 100% period text book one piece gladiator luftschutz, and a very good example of one at that!. Jim G.

Agree Jim, another good piece of history ruined

[helmet2id]

Las Vegas, to be brief, in response to your question, on this particular piece, yes. I accept the fact that often a definitive answer cannot be arrived at by looking at pictures alone, but in some cases, such as this one, the pictures are enough. Owning a dozen or so helmets with this liner configuration, and having handled literally hundreds more over the years, leaving the issue of the decal aside, it is clear to me from the pictures that in addition to the fact that the shell and paint are unquestionably authentic, that the liner material is period, that the installation method is correct - notice the squared off cork spacers for example, and the look of the rivets - and that the chinstrap is original. Simply because the liner shows little to no wear DOES NOT MEAN that it is a reproduction. One of the drawbacks of a forum type venue is that a real helmet can be maligned by an opinion that is based upon speculation, and not a visual evaluation of a piece and reliance on basic knowledge and overall experience. So called "hard and fast" rules do not always apply, and some of the assumptions that you have made do not apply across the board. Sure, these helmets were issued to home guard personnel who often had to fight the fires that resulted from allied bombing, but that does not mean that ALL of these helmets were used in that capacity. Maybe this piece was issued to a L/S member in a town where no bombs fell, or the poor guy was killed the first time out fighting a blaze, who knows? I have dented and dinged L/S helmets that attest to the fact that the poor sob's who wore them went through utter hell, AND MINTY examples that suggest that the owners sat in air conditioned bunkers sipping beer while the bombs fell and the fires raged above them. You must always evaluate condition, but that is not the only consideration that should be given weight. The liner in this piece is pristine, but in my opinion, the condition of the liner on this piece is not really inconsistent with the condition of the rest of the piece. I am by no means the go to expert, and absolutely agree that everyone is entitled to their opinions, but I am a lawyer by profession, and when I pick a juror to sit on a case that i am going to try, I look for someone who is willing to evaluate the total picture, rely on the evidence, and utilize his or her common sense and life's experience to decide the case, and not decide the case on speculative "what if's" when the facts are available upon which the decision should be made. Anyway, I've got to go to work, there are people to sue out there (just a little joke, I am primarily an insurance defense lawyer and defend those who have been sued by my fellow sharks!). Sorry for the long winded response, but I just can't seem ever to be brief. Cheers, Jim G.

[FrankBooth]

On page 395 of the Saris book "Handbook of the Hitlerjugend" there is a period photo of some uniforms and helmets of the HJ Feuerwhrscheren. I'm not a helmet guy, but the helmets appear to be the fire brigade style with the chrome "comb" on the top. Not the most clear photo but the helmets do appear to have an HJ diamond on the side similar to the one shown in the begining of the thread. It's the only period photo I've personally seen of this diamond insignia on a helmet.

[helmet2id]

On page 395 of the Saris book "Handbook of the Hitlerjugend" there is a period photo of some uniforms and helmets of the HJ Feuerwhrscheren. I'm not a helmet guy, but the helmets appear to be the fire brigade style with the chrome "comb" on the top. Not the most clear photo but the helmets do appear to have an HJ diamond on the side similar to the one shown in the begining of the thread. It's the only period photo I've personally seen of this diamond insignia on a helmet.

Hi Frank, I do not have that book. Could you take a shot of the page and post it? I wonder if it is the same picture that is in the Baer book. The helmets in the picture in the Baer book are lined up on lockers in a fire brigade locker room, and have HJ decals, but the diamonds in those decals are not "stand alone" like the decal on the piece that started this thread. Rather, the diamonds in the decals on the helmets in that picture are in standard sized black bordered shields. It would be great to see a period photo with a stand alone HJ diamond decal. Thanks in advance, Jim G.

[John Brandon]

Jim
If that's you being brief, I'd hate to be in court with you

Superb answer

[FrankBooth]

Hi Frank, I do not have that book. Could you take a shot of the page and post it? I wonder if it is the same picture that is in the Baer book. The helmets in the picture in the Baer book are lined up on lockers in a fire brigade locker room, and have HJ decals, but the diamonds in those decals are not "stand alone" like the decal on the piece that started this thread. Rather, the diamonds in the decals on the helmets in that picture are in standard sized black bordered shields. It would be great to see a period photo with a stand alone HJ diamond decal. Thanks in advance, Jim G.

It's the same photo in both books.