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Kriegsverdienstkreuz 1.Klasse mit Schwertern for review

Article about: Hey all, Now that I've gotten the picture uploading issue resolved, here is yet another piece from the big haul. Having dug into The Awards of the Heer reference book, it seems that the only

  1. #1

    Default Kriegsverdienstkreuz 1.Klasse mit Schwertern for review

    Hey all,

    Now that I've gotten the picture uploading issue resolved, here is yet another piece from the big haul. Having dug into The Awards of the Heer reference book, it seems that the only unmarked crosses made were by Petz and Lorenz. I've looked high and low for a maker's mark and don't see one. I do notice two things though:

    1: There is a green tarnish on the cross. My understanding is that copper tarnishes green, and silver tarnishes black. From what I've read, this award was made from zinc and then silver washed. Not sure what to make of this.

    2: The pommels on the swords are small (almost identical in width to the grip). I have seen iterations of this award with the small pommels, but I have yet to find a definitive picture of a Petz and Lorenz piece to compare.

    Kriegsverdienstkreuz 1.Klasse mit Schwertern for reviewKriegsverdienstkreuz 1.Klasse mit Schwertern for reviewKriegsverdienstkreuz 1.Klasse mit Schwertern for reviewKriegsverdienstkreuz 1.Klasse mit Schwertern for reviewKriegsverdienstkreuz 1.Klasse mit Schwertern for reviewKriegsverdienstkreuz 1.Klasse mit Schwertern for reviewKriegsverdienstkreuz 1.Klasse mit Schwertern for reviewKriegsverdienstkreuz 1.Klasse mit Schwertern for review

    Thoughts and wisdom appreciated as always!

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  3. #2

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    Wilhelm Deumer also made them unmarked, but with a different shaped pin.
    Ralph.
    Searching for anything relating to, Anton Boos, 934 Stamm. Kp. Pz. Erz. Abt. 7, 3 Kompanie, Panzer-Regiment 2, 16th Panzer-Division (My father)

  4. #3

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    Quote by rbminis View Post
    Wilhelm Deumer also made them unmarked, but with a different shaped pin.
    Ralph.
    Thanks for the info Ralph. What do you make of my example?

  5. #4

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    Quote by Rock Rey View Post
    Thanks for the info Ralph. What do you make of my example?
    I haven't been able to find one with this hardware set up yet. As far as I can find out so far, the only maker to have this cast hinge and catch is 65, Klien & Quenzer but I believe they were all marked. I believe the pin is the correct shape, can you post a straight on reverse photo with the pin in the catch?
    Still looking.
    Ralph.
    Searching for anything relating to, Anton Boos, 934 Stamm. Kp. Pz. Erz. Abt. 7, 3 Kompanie, Panzer-Regiment 2, 16th Panzer-Division (My father)

  6. #5

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    The closest that I can find leads me to believe this is an unmarked 65.
    The sword handles are the same shape, the pin is the correct shape and the hinge and catch are cast, like this one.
    Best wait for other opinions.
    Ralph.
    Searching for anything relating to, Anton Boos, 934 Stamm. Kp. Pz. Erz. Abt. 7, 3 Kompanie, Panzer-Regiment 2, 16th Panzer-Division (My father)

  7. #6

    Default

    Ralph,

    Thanks very much for the assistance! While that Awards of the Heer set I bought is a great reference tool, it doesn't go into complete detail on each award. Looks like I have more books to buy.

  8. #7

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    Quote by Rock Rey View Post
    Ralph,

    Thanks very much for the assistance! While that Awards of the Heer set I bought is a great reference tool, it doesn't go into complete detail on each award. Looks like I have more books to buy.
    Hey Rock,

    I tried to upload some images of my marked '65' to show what Ralph was talking about however, I can't for some reason at this moment in time.

    If you want a decent reference site, google "kvk dna" I've found it very useful in learning the differences in war merit crosses.

    Stefans site also shows comparisons of kvk2 and ek2, way cheaper than buying books!

    If you do go onto the site, look at how similar a '65' is to a Steinhauer & Luck '4' with only small variations in the pin hook and the handles of the swords.

    All the best

    Jamie

  9. #8

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    Quote by jamie7d7 View Post
    Hey Rock,

    I tried to upload some images of my marked '65' to show what Ralph was talking about however, I can't for some reason at this moment in time.

    If you want a decent reference site, google "kvk dna" I've found it very useful in learning the differences in war merit crosses.

    Stefans site also shows comparisons of kvk2 and ek2, way cheaper than buying books!

    If you do go onto the site, look at how similar a '65' is to a Steinhauer & Luck '4' with only small variations in the pin hook and the handles of the swords.

    All the best

    Jamie
    Jamie,

    Thanks very much for the good steer online. I will check that out for sure. I'm still suspicious of the green tarnish though.

  10. #9

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    Apparently Klein and Quenzer DID make unmarked iron crosses, but I cannot find any mention of them making unmarked KVKs. It does look quite a bit like the Klein and Quenzer example on KVK DNA.

    Everything I've read says that zinc shouldn't tarnish, and the reference book I have lists the material(s) used by Klein and Quenzer as Tombak with a zinc coating. Although it could be a the zinc coating wearing off and the high copper content Tombak below tarnishing.

    I feel funny about this one...

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