Kriegsverdienstkreuz 1. Klasse Schraube züruck - L/58

[jamie7d7]

Purely coincidence but the next thread in this section is another L/58 screwback!

Received this last week and have increased my screwback total by 100%

Lovely condition tombac with the vast majority of the shinyness remaining

[Franjo Vuk]

Very nice and shiny KVK1 indeed.

Best regards,
Franko

[BMB]

Hi Jamie!
Looks like a nice cross but I have some thoughts.

If I compare this kind of cross as you show here with known zinc crosses made by Souval then this one not look the same in the design as the zinc crosses and I think that's a bit strange.

I also have a KVK2 Souval tombak cross which has the same appearance as the KVK1 zinc crosses has.

See pictures below on which I have pointed out which characteristics I want to se on Souvals crosses.

1. Die flow On the swordhandle.
2. Top on an oak leaf.
3. ”Extra” cut in the oak leaves.

Best regards
Martin

[Franjo Vuk]

Hi Martin, you actually can not compare Souvals pinback kvk1 or kvk2 with this screwback version. Both zinc and tombak screwback versions were made from the same die, so they should not and do not have those features which you pointed out and which you can find on Souvals pinback tombak kvk1 as far as I am aware, but you never know with Souval. So the best thing to do is to avoid him and his items entirely, at least I do that, because I am not absolutely comfortable with any of his iron or war merit crosses or any other combat awards like panzerkampf badges for example and so on.

Best regards,
Franko

[BMB]

Hi Franko!
I do not really know what you mean when you write about the screwback model, I borrow a image of the screwback zinc variant from the previous thread by torpeda3945 and it has those features which I pointed out on my crosses. See picture.

I agree with you about Souval, it's hard to know what is wartime or not.

Best regards
Martin

[jamie7d7]

Souval does indeed have a dubious reputation amongst EK and KVK collectors.

The cross I show doesn't have the flaw on the right handle but it does match other wartime Souvals that I have seen. And it is known that Souval did use a number of dies therefore there are different variations out there.

I am confident that this is a wartime KVK1 however, I'm gonna do some digging to put my mind at rest.

J

[BMB]

Hi Jamie!
I do not know if your cross is original or not, but I'm skeptical. Do not forget the two other characters that I have pointed out.

Best regards
Martin

[Franjo Vuk]

Well then, I was wrong obviously. It seems that those features some Souval war merit crosses have and some other do not have, regardless if they are pinback or screwback variants and regardless if they are made from zinc or tombak. I am also not sure if Jamies example is wartime item, but I would not be sure even in case that it has those three characteristics because Souval made some iron crosses for example after the war which are almost exactly the same or literally the same as some which that producer had made during the war, because he used leftovers which were made during the war (frames, cores, hinges, catches and pins) but that crosses were assembled after the war, so it is impossible to tell which is which, you can be sure only if some piece is coming from some veteran grouping, otherwise it is impossible to now for sure and without any uncertainty and probably the same situation is with war merit crosses as well. I think it will never be certain one hundred percent if this piece is wartime item and not just this one but also every other Souval award. I think that only case when you can be absolutely sure is if it came from some veteran grouping as I already mentioned.

Best regards,
Franko