Help needed with luftwaffe insignia

**mjw** · 03-10-2009, 01:06 AM

Hello everyone.

This is my first post – and attempt at posting pictures!

I mainly collect medals and insignia relating to the RAF.

I also have an interest in flying badges pre 1945 of all nations. In my collection I have a few German items that I would like to ask for help with determining if they are considered to be original pre-1945 items – or copies/fakes etc.

I have had these items for over 20 years – which means nothing except they could be older fakes etc.

What do you make of them?

**Espenlaub Militaria** · 03-10-2009 01:06 AM

We also buy and trade your items and full collections!

**mjw** · 03-10-2009, 01:08 AM

I have just noticed that the colour of the paper backing appears purple. It is black and due to my scanner. The cloth itself is also black.

Kind regards, Malcolm.

**mjw** · 03-10-2009, 01:13 AM

I would appreciate any opinions on this example also.

Kind regards, Malcolm.

**Adrian Stevenson** · 03-10-2009, 11:01 AM

Hi Malcolm, welcome to the forum!

I strongly believe the first is Indian/Pakistani made fake. The type of thread used on the observers badge reminds me of many fake British cloth badges done in the sub continent. The colour is also odd not being silver/grey like most originals. These often come with that colour backing too which tends to look like that on a monitor. The poorly done swastika is a really bad sign on any German badge. Any malformed swastika is always a "red flag".

The construction of the Pilots badge is not the usual multi type bullion thread found on many German made badges. The design is a bit poorly done too with the long legs to the eagle. But I would not dismiss this one totally out of hand yet. The backing cloth appears to be "Trikot" ribbed wool? This is a "possible". The more I look at it the better I like it. Lets see what others say who specialise on this type of material. These bullion badges can be hard at times to determind. I wish I could be more certain for you.

Like you say, age can mean nothing now. Some fakes are now getting on for 50 years old. Genuine age to these can now fool the unwary.

Cheers, Ade.

**mjw** · 03-10-2009, 12:58 PM

Hello Ade,

Thank you for the kind reply and useful information. I take on board your points mentioned. I have enclosed two more close ups that may help with the second badge.

Kind regards, Malcolm.

**mjw** · 03-10-2009, 08:29 PM

I have included pictures of two other breast eagles hopefully for discussion.

Kind regards, Malcolm.

**Adrian Stevenson** · 03-10-2009, 09:01 PM

Hi Malcolm, thanks for the additional images of the pilots badge. Not sure I can add any more info on that one though.

The other two Luftwaffe breast eagles are interesting.

The triangular backed one is considered a tropical eagle, but the colour of the backing cloth is most unusual: this is normally a light tan brown and not green. Having said that, I like the look of it. The embroidery is well exucuted and it has the details to the feathers etc.

The Generals breast eagle is the early pattern with droop tail. The quality of this one also looks good and I like the toned appearance of the bullion.

Cheers, Ade.

**mjw** · 03-10-2009, 09:37 PM

Hello Ade,

Thank you once again for your informative and interesting reply. It has helped me greatly. I would like to learn why the tropical eagle is on a green background rather than the expected tan?

Kind regards, Malcolm.