Hello all I was just sent a couple of pics showing a bayonet style I am not familiar with The fittings appear to be chromed ?? any thoughts? Regards G.
Quick ID and thoughts
Hello all I was just sent a couple of pics showing a bayonet style I am not familiar with The fittings appear to be chromed ?? any thoughts? Regards G.
Looks to be a parade/private purchase version of the german S1871/84 bayonet, but I would call it a transitional version of around the time the S84/98 was introduced in 1905. This is because it lacks the muzzle ring like a S84/98 but in other respects, such as the pommel detail, is a S71/84. I would see this as a transition as makers modified existing parts to conform to the new pattern.
Cannot get a more detailed and accurate description beyond Anderson. Nice work!
John
Is not a S71/84 as the press button is other side on pommel, it could be some export piece, that was later refurbished to dress configuration in manner of S71/84. There was probably a hook on guard, same as blade was longer. b.r.Andy
Good point, but you need to remember, at the time this was made, there was NO specification makers had to follow with regards parade bayonets. They had a free hand on construction unlike in the military contracts. So the side for the mortice button (and some were non functioning) is immaterial. As I said this appears to be a hydrid based on the S1871/84 but modified to reflect the new S84/98. And yes, surplus longer blades could be cannibalized to fit the purpose.
It has been a long while since I've seen one, but I remember at shows seeing chrome plated Japanese rifles, bayonets, and pistols etc. - sometimes German items likewise chrome plated, and of course sometimes the same for U.S. Not for military use but perhaps for some school or other group - or maybe because the owner thought at the time it was a good idea? One of the least practical examples I remember was a German Luger pistol that had to be reworked a little to get all the parts back together (because of the close clearances) that I'm fairy certain would have been a "Jam-omatic" if somebody had been foolish enough and tried to actually shoot it.Best Regards, Fred
Hello Anderson i believe You are not fully corect here, as germans already have dress S1871 and earlier pieces, so the S71/84 was clear design, here is with high possibility a argentine M1891 contract piece,that was probably not delivered with new wooden grips ,shortened blade, removed barell ring and hook and nickeled, and added a S71/84 scabbard, You should compare the blade profile, dimmension and others.b.r.Andy
You miss my point. The parade bayonet is an construction based on the S71/84 style and without the muzzle ring like the S84/98. It may well have come from the parts bucket of left over bits, but the intention is clear to make in the preferred style of the knife bayonets probably around 1905 (when the s84/98 was introduced). Whether the blade came off an Argentine bayonet is not the point. My earlier point was the parade bayonet manufactured in that early 1900's era were not under the same specification requirements of military contracts. You can see that in the variety of blade types used. The military contract S71/84 "was clear design" but not the parade/private purchase models. There is a difference.
Good Solid Thread !!... well done Gents keep it going
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Fred, i'm not quite sure what point you are making, but you may be inferring the plating on this bayonet dates from post ww2. If so, I'd point out the wood grip plates are riveted to the bayonet with original type rivets used on the S1871/84. In other words they can't be removed. My understanding is you would not attempt metal plating with attached wood grips.
Another point I'd add is I have seen a Reichwehr used S98/05 (butcher bayonet) that has been cut down to the dimensions and size of the S84/98. There was a period in the early 20th century, where Germany was using several different patterns of bayonets and it wasn't really until 1934 and Third Reich and arrival of the 3rd type S84/98 that standardization was achieved.
A couple of photos, a parade/private purchase S1871/84 and a photo from 1923 and SA men, the officer at the right still happy to wear his parade S1871/84, even though a obsolete pattern.
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