WARNING - GRAPHIC IMAGES - Lot of 9 Pictures Taken at KL Buchenwald - Opinions Needed

[CARL]

The photographs are an historic record of the brutality carried out by the Nazi's on the Jews and other groups of people. It shouldn't matter who collects them as long as they don't end up being destroyed. The important thing is that they are preserved so that the past cannot be denied.

Patently, well said.

[big ned]

As I have said before on this forum, some people may find it somewhat sick to collect this kind of thing. But the same people who think that may have no problems whatsoever collecting items from the SS - the very people who committed these evil crimes. It is sometimes best to keep your opinions to yourself before you end up being accused of double standards. There are many people in the wider world who consider collectors of Nazi memorabilia as being sick. Not everyone views militaria as we collectors do.

The photographs are an historic record of the brutality carried out by the Nazi's on the Jews and other groups of people. It shouldn't matter who collects them as long as they don't end up being destroyed. The important thing is that they are preserved so that the past cannot be denied.

Hi Steve,

I would like to clarify my position on the points you raise. Although I have studied closely the the finer points of certain SS awards such as the 4 and 8 year long service medals, by both reading, and discussing them in hand, and over the internet, this has been only through interest in being able to define originals from fakes, and the minutae of the differences in such pieces that enable this. I have not, and neither desire to own such pieces in my collection. The same goes for SS daggers, helmets, collar tabs, cuff titles and kampfbinde, because I would not be comfortable with owning them personally, and that's my choice.

But I do have many Panzerkampfabzeichen badges, several gold, silver and black wound badges, a DKiG, Iron Crosses both 1st and 2nd class and a fair mix of other combat awards, award documents and original photo's etc. that at least, some of, may have been awarded to SS personnel, but who can say for sure? The point that they are not exclusively connected to the SS is enough to assuage any guilt on my part, which I know can appear to smack of double standards or self denial, but that's how I choose to deal with it.

As far as owning such photographs goes, on a largely different scale, there is in my family a photo album that shows my fathers service in the XII Royal Lancers that has numerous pictures of him and his mates at the site of Bergen-Belsen KZ that shows empty burial pits, mass graves and many buildings, with them leaning on signs saying 'Here lie buried 2,500 bodies' smiling for the camera or joking around. These were taken in 1952 when he was based near there, the camp had only been closed for a year as it was used for 'displaced persons' until then. Looking at those photo's now is somewhat uncomfortable for me, even though they were just 19 or 20 year old lads who seem unaware of the facts of what happened there, but they are a part of my family's history, and are treasured as such.

So taking those personal feelings and thoughts onboard, then maybe I am guilty of double standards in the eyes of some, as we all here are by many other non collectors out there in the world, but that's my own view of these things. I should like to make it clear that I fully agree that these images and all others in the same vein should be kept for posterity as a reminder to all future generations of what depravity man is capable of, but at the same time, as Jerry states above, I feel they should be for display by proper museums or in the possession of serious researchers, rather than as an oblique part of a general WW2 collectors display.

Thanks for your forbearance of my conflicted opinions, I'm sure many of us share them to some degree or other, and apologies for my long winded reply.

Regards, Ned.

[WarCollector2019]

Having looked again, it seems to me that bottom left photograph (crematoria ovens) is the same -- somewhat cropped -- as one attributed to the US Army Signal Corps, in the collection of the Truman Library (Truman Library View Photograph: Furnaces at Buchenwald concentration camp.).

Philip

Hi Philip,

I too was looking at that picture for a match - however, they are not the same photo as the contents of the crematoria ovens are different.

Thank you, Glen.

[WarCollector2019]

As I have said before on this forum, some people may find it somewhat sick to collect this kind of thing. But the same people who think that may have no problems whatsoever collecting items from the SS - the very people who committed these evil crimes. It is sometimes best to keep your opinions to yourself before you end up being accused of double standards. There are many people in the wider world who consider collectors of Nazi memorabilia as being sick. Not everyone views militaria as we collectors do.

The photographs are an historic record of the brutality carried out by the Nazi's on the Jews and other groups of people. It shouldn't matter who collects them as long as they don't end up being destroyed. The important thing is that they are preserved so that the past cannot be denied.

Thank you Harry - I couldn't have put it better myself!

Thank you, Glen.

[WarCollector2019]

Glen, numerous Konzentrationslagers had a series of images taken post liberation. Many such images were later available through members of the press. Often, liberators and former inmates would acquire copies of such images from the photographer to keep as a reminder of the experience. Whilst examples of this nature are hardly common, they are not quite as rare as some would believe.

Hi Carl,

If that is the case and they are press photographs that would mean that they must have produced numerous sets. Have you seen a set matching these images? Or have the same images cropped up in any publications?

Thank you, Glen.

[CARL]

Hi Carl,

If that is the case and they are press photographs that would mean that they must have produced numerous sets. Have you seen a set matching these images? Or have the same images cropped up in any publications?

Thank you, Glen.

Hi Glen,

Some of the images shown above are very similar to known press images - albeit with slight variations on angle of the photograph etc. That said, it doesn't mean the image was taken by the same hand - a private image may well have been taken alongside a press image. Of this type of post liberation photograph - from this particular concentration camp, many slight variations exist of the piles of corpses that were outside the crematorium facility at KZ-Buchenwald (shown below in the image taken several years ago during a study visit).

In answer to your first question, yes, any press series images taken at the liberation (or immediate aftermath) of a concentration camp were produced in quantity.

These photographs need to be examined in hand - with a black light test (remember to carefully peel the reverse so as to check the inner paper layer too). Some feel such images command vast sums of money yet the true value is to the preservation of the memory of those who died and also to the history of the site.

[CARL]

The crematorium facility, visible in the images shown earlier.

[CARL]

This thread, created by forum member Dean, shows images taken by American forces at the camp.

Buchenwald framed liberation (graphic)to victims..

[WarCollector2019]

Thank you Carl for the additional information.

Thank you, Glen.

[Jerry B]

I don't collect any German TR period items any more, though I still have a few which will be sold when I get my act together to do so. I have only had a very small number of SS items in my collection over the years and they went many years back except for one item which I failed to sell a few years back and one tropical eagle, which will go sooner or later when I sell the remainder of my TR tropical collection.

These days I do not feel comfortable having any such items in my home and all will be gone sooner or later.

I have no issues with others collecting TR items, but I still think that items such as these should not be a casual component of a collection. I agree with Steve that such items should be preserved, but how and by whom that is done is a different matter and such items should IMO be placed within a framework of serious study and only be displayed for educational and or historical purposes.