waffen ss tunic dodgy at best

[hawkins]

thats right and i am the first to say i dont know a lot about foreign insignia but seems there saying there is no way the ss used foreign insignia in the lah well that is out right wrong ....

this statement is taken out of context. Most of what was made for the SS was made in Ravensbrook and Dachau among other KC's. If you were an enlisted member of the Waffen SS, then you might have even been issued a re-furbsihed Heer Tunic. It depends on the years we are talking about and the units. The 1st SS , LSSAH cuff titles were NOT foreign made. They were manufactured early on in the formation of the unit under Sepp Dietrich in Leipzig, Germany. With regards to this tunic, being that the insignia shown is of an officer rank, especially at the rank of Sturmbannfuher, most of the higher officer ranks had their insignia privately made or drawn from a RZM approved vendor like Schumer. The insignia was not polyester as is this insignia is obviously so, as well as the cuff title and the Tunic itself. This is my last comment on this because I think enough has been said on the subject. Its clear that this guy who claims that this tunic is not even his, so for what purpose he posted it here I have no clue other then to gain opinions on the Tunic. He has certainly gotten plenty of opinions and whether or not you choose to ignore or apply these opinions is entirely up to you.
Good Luck

that's what posting here is about right ? .

[hawkins]

Compare the top of your cuff title(https://www.warrelics.eu/forum/milit...t-h2170002.jpg)
with the top of the cuff title in this thread that you provided (Vlaanderen...land of beauty - Page 109 - Wehrmacht-Awards.com Militaria Forums) even a distressed, worn cuff isn't as bad looking as the one on the jacket that you are showing, because the one on your friends jacket is made of plastic. It's loose and doesn't sit right because it's probably plastic or something. quilty

Edit:
I should be super careful about what I say about this tunic, as I collect Heer tunics mostly, but I get a bad feeling about the insignia and it looks like a pieced together tunic to me. I hope that something on here is real so that it's not a total loss for your buddy. I'm sorry if I got a bit "shouty" at you, I mistook your intentions at first. I just get frustrated seeing people come on this forum with a dodgy or bad item and just argue with and harass the people who are just trying to help them for like 10 pages without taking on anything that people try and tell them. I'm out of my depth on SS stuff, so I shouldn't say more, but the fussy craftsmanship for an organization that would have made your trace your ancestors back for centuries? It's 100% not there for me.

thats fine ha i ant not slug with tunics yet this one has me , i had the same thoughts , i spent hours hunting down the infoe i have found so far pulled out all the books ha i am fully aware of the lah and german Quality but i am all so aware of the odd balls and lah useing foreign stuff , at least i am putting up info i have spent hours looking up wright or wrong . ha if it was a german made tabs rzm cuff i would not even ask , funny i am asking and seems the attitude and assumptions is some what .

[BOB COLEMAN]

Only so much can be determined from photographs when it comes to uniforms. I agree that the insignia appers to be foreign made, which has been a known fact for many years. I personally can not acurately determine the construction of the cuff title from these images. There is no way this tunic is a East German military tunic that has been rebadged.

[Adrian]

Dude, how could you fit another award under that EK1? (https://www.warrelics.eu/forum/milit...t-h2170013.jpg) By sloppy, I mean the shoulder boards are coming out, and the insignia is REALLY poorly applied for an elite, if not THE elite unit of Nazi Germany! That poor kid would have been shot for putting that cuff title and those shoulder boards on like that! It's a put together for sure, but I should retract my earlier statement about polyester, I just have no idea what this tunic was, but there's no way that an original LAH tunic looked like this!

Just change the subject slightly, the EK1 in the above link is a fake. I have no idea who the tunic belongs to but might be worth mentioning to the owner?

[BOB COLEMAN]

It is always unwise to make pronouncements when you do not have knowledge to back up your statement. I personlly do not like the way the collar tabs sit on the collar. The shoulder board may be poorly installed or it may have experienced post war damage. My thoughts are that this tunic was partially stripped of insignia and then rebuilt. The observations is based soley on the photographs and in hand, the interpretation might change.

[Mark K]

Very Interesting thread just chiming in so I can keep an eye on it.

Regards Mark K

[Wagriff]

Plus you dont see white thread being used to stitch the colored collar pad on.

Hmm....maybe my eyes are just old, but it looks like Grey thread, to me....
Personally, I think this whole trouncing of this lad with this tunic is awful. He's said that it's not His and the photos he's provided were all that were possible. He's repeatedly asked for someone to show him a 6 button East German tunic that looks like this one, since it's been so vociferously shouted that that is what it is, and no one has yet to post a photo of one. He's never pretended like it was anything but questionable to him and simply wanted to know why it is looking like it does and why it might be in it's present state.
For what it's worth, my impression of it is the same that Bob said-it looks like a tunic that was stripped and then reassembled. Possibly with whatever insignia the re-assembler had available, which just happened to be Flemish made pieces. Tricot, polyester, silk, plastic....Me, I can't tell just what the thing is made of by looking at low quality photos. The poster said it's made of Tricot and He examined it in Hand. Until I actually had it unbuttoned and lying on the table in front of me, I would not make a 100% definitive statement of it's material.
People do actually come to this forum on occasion to discuss items they're not sure about or want more information on. Not Everyone comes here to try to fool the experts and sell fraudulent pieces. The reaction to this poster's perfectly reasonable questions about this tunic have been awful.

[Arran]

Perhaps the moderator Bob Hritz, who is well versed in SS cloth, would chime in regarding the insignia. There was a huge variety of insignia made in Belgium for the Germans, and this included a lot of SS and even LAH insignia, as shown in those photos above. Collectors in Belgium are well aware of the history of this insignia, right down to the details of some of the companies that made it! Also, claiming that you can tell the fibre content of fabric by those pics is a bit...presumptuous. I have a degree in textile conservation and I'd be reluctant to make such statements!

[Eddie]

I'd like to apologize for my earlier comments. This isn't an area that I collect really, and I shouldn't have commented on the item in question the way that I did. I mis-read the original poster's intentions on this piece, and I probably should not have been up so late posting. I did read this as just another thread of someone trying to sell a bad piece, or justify their bad purchase and harangue the people on this forum who are trying to share their knowledge. I think in this instance I was involved in the haranguing and I feel embarrassed.
Mea Culpa,
Eddie

[BOB COLEMAN]

Perhaps the moderator Bob Hritz, who is well versed in SS cloth, would chime in regarding the insignia. There was a huge variety of insignia made in Belgium for the Germans, and this included a lot of SS and even LAH insignia, as shown in those photos above. Collectors in Belgium are well aware of the history of this insignia, right down to the details of some of the companies that made it! Also, claiming that you can tell the fibre content of fabric by those pics is a bit...presumptuous. I have a degree in textile conservation and I'd be reluctant to make such statements!

Bob has had a crash of his hard drive and is presently trying to get his system up and working.