Why would this dagger be questionable?

[Tomaz]

I thought it was a WKC pommel with the stipples and some extra hand work but guessing that would be too easy.

Tomaz

[gerrit]

I thought it was a WKC pommel with the stipples and some extra hand work but guessing that would be too easy.

Tomaz

Hi Tomaz

that dotted background on this type of pommel it typical for Höller.

best
Ger

[Tomaz]

Thats interesting, i have seen this same Holler stippled pommel on quite a number of WKC's, there is also a navy pommel designed very similar to Holler's standard that is also often found on WKC's navy daggers, would it be likely for a large company like WKC to have had some parts supplied to them by Holler? I don't know how many companies feature this but you can also see WKC army scabbards with the two hand done acorns on the edges of the bands like Hollers, is this also a WKC feature? I know Eickhorn supplied WKC with scabbards, perhaps Holler also supplied them with parts as well. Or could WKC have supplied these army pommels to Holler with stippled backgrounds to differentiate them from their own, the leaf design does appear to be the same?

Tomaz.

[gerrit]

Thats interesting, i have seen this same Holler stippled pommel on quite a number of WKC's, there is also a navy pommel designed very similar to Holler's standard that is also often found on WKC's navy daggers, would it be likely for a large company like WKC to have had some parts supplied to them by Holler? I don't know how many companies feature this but you can also see WKC army scabbards with the two hand done acorns on the edges of the bands like Hollers, is this also a WKC feature? I know Eickhorn supplied WKC with scabbards, perhaps Holler also supplied them with parts as well. Or could WKC have supplied these army pommels to Holler with stippled backgrounds to differentiate them from their own, the leaf design does appear to be the same.

Tomaz.

Tomaz to me there is no doubt they bought from eachother.
A Friend of mine runs a knife shop and sells Solinger knives only.
He talk(s)-(ed) to many Solingen producers like Klaas etc. and they all said it was common use buying by fellow producers the parts you came short of.
Sometimes the simply took the bike to get a box of crossguards etc..

Regards
Ger

[Tomaz]

Not convinced the pommel on the dagger this thread is about is as Ger says a Holler pommel i decided to do some searching for examples of these stippled Holler and WKC pommels. Using lakesidetrader.com (archives) as a reference source i was able after just a few examples (of which there are many which all show the same detail) to easily see the difference between the two. If you look at the lip just below the leaves (pics below) you can see that it is noticeably bigger/more bulbous on Holler pommels than WKC's, the lips are also more rounded on Holler's and the gap between the two lips is also smaller. You can also see this in Heeresdolche book on page 107 (Holler) and page 239 (WKC). So i don't think the pommel on the dagger this thread is about is a Holler pommel as it has the smaller WKC lip, this also fits in with the WKC crossguard. Here are two Holler and two WKC pommels, notice the difference in the size of the lips just below the leaves and acorns, you can see this on all the examples of these pommels in lakesidetrader.com (archives), i found others on other sites but too many to mention.

Tomaz.

Holler

[Tomaz]

Wkc

[heers68]

Your right Tomaz.. the Holler mid to late pommel like this always have the rounded bands around the base.. Kevin.

[gerrit]

Thx Tomaz for pointing that out, i just looked at the dots and overlooked the rim!
Well done.

Regards
Ger