Heeres Flakabzeichen

[OH67273]

Good evening, I'm new to the forum and need help. I am trying to determine if the Heer Flak badge is real or a reproduction. I have a chance to purchase it. Purportedly a vet bring back. All comments appreciated. Thanks OH67273

[rbminis]

Hello and welcome to the forum!
These are not my area of study but this one looks like it is trying to be a Steinhauer & Lück but I see some discrepancies. The catch appears correct but the hinge is not. There are some rivets missing from around the base of the 88 as well.
Hopefully someone with more knowledge in this area will be along to help you.
Ralph.

[OH67273]

Hi Ralph, thank you. The hinge and the incomplete mark on the reverse side are what I focused on. I really like the obverse side. If it is a reproduction the eagle is really nice. I just can't say for certain, that's why it's always good to have some other eyes looking and commenting. Chuck.

[GeneralPutnam]

IMOA
The obverse is very crisp and well executed and looks tight.
The problems I have is with the two marks at the end of the 88 barrel. and the fact that all of the tips of the acorns seem to be exaggerated and/elongated.
the reverse seems to as you said an incomplete mark and the pin configuration is wonky .
The front looks too good to me ( yes I cant have nice things )
. If anyone who knows these inside and out and it turns out to be 100% its great looking.
But if it was me to many issues and lack of experience, I wouldn't buy it.

[rbminis]

The acorn appearance are typical of St. & L, as are the two marks on the end of the barrel. The block hinge should be a wrap around hinge with an oval base. I haven't found anything authentic with a partial maker's mark on the back.
Ralph.

[big ned]

IMO this is one of the many post war made S&L badges that date from 1945 right up to at least the 1970's, and could therefore be called a fake. The small block hinge was used by them during wartime on the late production "Monster" PAB and GAB badges, and perhaps some others including late zinc Para badges. Here's an example of the period "Monster" GAB small block hinge.



Some of the post war badges S&L awards were made up of genuine unused wartime production badges with different hardware fitted, others still later were made using the original dies, but what seems to link most of these is the small block hinge that can be found on many of S&L's postwar production of Heer, Luftwaffe and Kriegsmarine badges. The currently accepted way of spotting the difference from period to postwar badges is the presence of the S&L " '57 scrape" a tool mark that is found just below the pin bend caused when the pin was formed. This is not found on wartime badges, they have a small "dimple" if anything. Here's some examples.



Now look at the OP's hinge with a similar mark that I've highlighted.



The flat wire 'C' shaped catch on a round base is found on both wartime and postwar '57 production and fake S&L badges. The alleged "maker mark" is just a flaw formed during the making of the badge, and various similar ones can be found in the same area of the reverse on many other manufacturers Heer and Luft flak badges.

That's only my theory regarding this badge and going on the information currently available as I understand it. So it may well be open to interpretation by others more au fait with the whole S&L war/post war production conundrum.

Regards, Ned.

[OH67273]

Hi Ned. Many thanks for your educational lesson. I read another thread you had responded to and between this one and the other I have learned a lot. Chuck.

[harryamb2]

fake it may be,but its a very nice looking badge.

[BOB COLEMAN]

Chuck-
Welcome to the Forum. I know wou will find this a positive place. It is the finest online forum with great authorities. I hope you show more of your fine collection in the future.

[OH67273]

Thanks, Now you can see my angst. I almost wish I could buy it (inexpensive) just to use for display. Chuck.