Stahlhelm Indonesian Style?

**feldgrau33** · 06-04-2013, 12:46 PM

Hello, couple of weeks ago i bought this peculiar stahlhelm!

No rim

Chinstrap ring using the ex-m1 chinstrap ring. And it's seems it's field made

Comparison with m1 chinstrap ring

Chinstrap using possibly ex-euro clone strap

Comparison with dutch east indies cloned stahlhelm

As you can see it's crude made and it's repainted with bright black paint. When i use the acetone, the old paint is black too. There's no place for the liner emplacement.
Since there's no documentation for this, i believe there's 2 possibility of the history of this peculiar helmet.
1. it's made during the independence war (1945-49), since this helmet is using ex m1 strap ring. Also it's crude made and no liner emplacement, so the wearer must put some cloth in the head. And maybe this shell was made by the home industry not industrial made. As conclusion "last ditch" helmet.
2. It's made after the independence war (1950 onward), maybe during the confrontation era in the 1960's. Maybe for the reserve forces in java. If we assume the ex-euro clone chinstrap was exist from beginning along with the helmet.

So what do you think about this helmet or maybe fellow collectors have any other alternative opinion?

**Greg Pickersgill** · 06-04-2013, 02:24 PM

Amazing. I can bet money you will have a hard task tracking down reliable information on this one! My considered guess would be the same as your option 1 - it being made during the National Revolution. Your second option seems less likely, as there was no danger of Indonesia being invaded during the Konfrontasi. And surely anyway there was enough properly-manufactured military equipment available by the mid-1960s? Third possibility - made by one of the groups in conflict with the Indonesian authorities?

**emileverbunt** · 06-04-2013, 08:57 PM

Hi Feldgrau,

Peculiar helmet. Since the helmet has a copy of the US M-1 swivel bale, I reckon it is a post 1950 private attempt. Greg might have a point with his suggestion about opposition groups.

The TNI had acces to KNIL helmets, the M35 clones, Japanese helmets and a considerable number of UK MkII's. The M-1 came with the Dutch Marine Corps and some KNIL units. Not a helmet that was captured a lot by the TNI. So I think the Indonesian blacksmith would not have an M-1 as a model to copy.

I have seen pictures of artisanaly produced helmets worn by the TNI that were of a very simple design. Logical I think, considering the Industrial potential in the Republican area of Java.

Your helmet does not fit this (my) theory. I might be wrong of course.

Nice helmets you have. You are building a nice and very unique collection! Did you ever weigh and measure them? Are there any markings?

Cheers and Tabeh,
Emile

**feldgrau33** · 06-05-2013, 05:31 AM

by Greg Pickersgill

Amazing. I can bet money you will have a hard task tracking down reliable information on this one! My considered guess would be the same as your option 1 - it being made during the National Revolution. Your second option seems less likely, as there was no danger of Indonesia being invaded during the Konfrontasi. And surely anyway there was enough properly-manufactured military equipment available by the mid-1960s? Third possibility - made by one of the groups in conflict with the Indonesian authorities?

Absolutely sir, i never see this kind of helmet before.

Hmmm the last great insurrection in java is the communist rebellion (PKI) in 1948 in madiun east java. And the seller said he got the helmet from malang, east java too. Could it be this helmet was made by those PKI member? Or maybe it's a bring back from the insurrection outside Java in the 1950-1960's. Too many possibility sir.

by emileverbunt

Hi Feldgrau,

Peculiar helmet. Since the helmet has a copy of the US M-1 swivel bale, I reckon it is a post 1950 private attempt. Greg might have a point with his suggestion about opposition groups.

The TNI had acces to KNIL helmets, the M35 clones, Japanese helmets and a considerable number of UK MkII's. The M-1 came with the Dutch Marine Corps and some KNIL units. Not a helmet that was captured a lot by the TNI. So I think the Indonesian blacksmith would not have an M-1 as a model to copy.

I have seen pictures of artisanaly produced helmets worn by the TNI that were of a very simple design. Logical I think, considering the Industrial potential in the Republican area of Java.

Your helmet does not fit this (my) theory. I might be wrong of course.

Nice helmets you have. You are building a nice and very unique collection! Did you ever weigh and measure them? Are there any markings?

Cheers and Tabeh,
Emile

Well about the m1 swivel bail sir, as far as i know america decide to put the swivel bails on the m1 helmet in 1943-44 and in my collection i have a transitional m1 helmet which is front seamed swivel bail. And the guerrilla did capture some of those helmet indeed, and who knows maybe they decide to make a new helmet from it? I guess this stahlhelm is on the same league with the helmet on your attachment?

3 different nations helmet on 1 photo!

M1 helmet in 1947 but i don't know belong to which side. The dutch or indonesian.

About the helmet on your attachment, could it be it's the same with this one?

Thank you sir, well i'm grateful i have some unique helmet collection from those stahlhelms, indonesian named mark II helmet, indonesian cloned m1 fixed bail, mysterious firehelmet, medieval helmet, until this one.

About the weight unfortunately i don't have any weight scale right now. But i do know it's heavier than the dutch east indies cloned stahlhelm. And there's no marking at all.

Oh and i forgot to put this

I guess this is an attempt to make an air vent on the left side of the helmet. I think at that time, they decide to discard that idea because there's no trace of the same hole on the helmet right side. Not enough time because of emergency situation?

**emileverbunt** · 06-07-2013, 08:53 AM

Hello Feldgrau,

The last picture you posted shows a KNIL helmet worn backwards. The other pic shows a Dutch Marine defuzing an IED. He put down his helmet better to tackle the explosive device.

The TNI captured more stuff than I realised! Quit a lot of M-1's.

I meant it would be a good idea to weigh and measure the M35 clones. It would be nice to compare them with the German product.

Tabeh,
Emile

**feldgrau33** · 06-07-2013, 03:39 PM

Ah i see.

Well i really want to buy a german m35 sir. I found there's one who sell that in here

but i don't know if that original. And i don't have enough money to buy it. This helmet price is equivalent with 8 m35 clone i got.

Oh sir, i found a similar helmet with this one. https://www.warrelics.eu/forum/steel...m40-sd-300553/ . But i guess for this german helmet, it's for biker indeed.