Railway dagger 1st model - opinions need

[mike1]

Hi all,
I would like to know your opinon about originality of 1st model Railway dagger marked by Klass. Here are pictures I was able to add, I do not have better, the dager is on auction.
Thanks, Mike

[Rancid66]

I do not like it.
Someone has mixed parts Eickhorn dagger and Klass.
To me it should look like:
E-534* First Model Railway Dagger
Moderator please upload photos.

And:

"Generally these -by collectors socalled 1st mod RRPP daggers- are highly controversial. Up to now to my best cnowledge there is no period "wearing" pic known to the public.
Also up to now there are no period regulations describing such a dagger.
Up to now nobody knows for sure if there was such a period model."

Regards
Vedran

[Larry C]

Hi Vedran you are correct in your assessment as this type of dagger is controversial with no clear answers. They are rare and only a mere few have been found ,, but not enough supporting evidence to prove its authenticity. I can only make one comment on this example above,,as these are not hard to fake at all. The grip ribs are fatter and do not count to 8 as this example above has 6 ribs. This dagger is a hard call to authenticate,,and would best to be left to the type collector.
I will upload photos tonight as the system I am on at work is not user friendly. If someone else could do it for me ,, by all means it would be helpful. Regards Larry

Thankyou Allen

[Frogprince]

Daggers with grips made of (black) Bakelite that was painted white when it left the factory, the "Luftwaffe Funeral Dagger" version also sold for a healthy price increase - "back in the day". And then some guys finally noticed that there were no "in wear" pictures at funerals. Zero. And nothing in the sales catalogs. Imagine that . With what I look at in hand are signs of steel wool, or some other evidence of paint removal work, with special attention to the protected locations like the grooves and surrounding areas. Re-polished grips etc. I'm usually not disappointed. Best Regards to All, Fred

[Larry C]

The "Funeral grips" was more of a description than fact ..but used to describe the black grip adding to the darkness of the dagger. Nothing more. Someone decided to create the idea that these daggers were used for funerals ( fact!! and no names mentioned ) and in turn were not..... and are exactly as you say ,,that they were painted white and time chipped off the paint,,and someone finishing the job of a full removal. IMO dark grips were not found as it was only a matter of a few years after their creation and the 70 some years of sunlight has not had a chance to darken to the extreme extent of total black or some deep maroon grips seen today. So dark gripped or black gripped Army and Luftwaffe daggers are not seen in period photos. It should also be taken into consideration if a dark gripped dagger is seen that the Half tones used in B&W photos will also make it appear darker.
I seen the red arrow of what your pointing at as far as the possible removal of white paint,, but still with this dagger it is not enough evidence to prove that the whole dagger itself is authentic 1st Railway.
A very easily parted together dagger from army parts and just adding a black grip!! Something like this is really worth about the price of a Regular Army dagger,,minus the authentication..but yet someone will try to put a $3000-4000 price tag on it,, because of a handful of parts. This is the hard balance with collecting these type of daggers when there is not enough information on them.
Personally I myself would choose to stay away from this type of dagger even if i did have the funds to buy it,,but i would rather walk away a rich man and be disappointed than to kick myself and find out later it is worth the price of an Army,, with the exception of the black grip. Hmmm sounds like a marriage Regards Larry

[mike1]

The "Funeral grips" was more of a description than fact ..but used to describe the black grip adding to the darkness of the dagger. Nothing more. Someone decided to create the idea that these daggers were used for funerals ( fact!! and no names mentioned ) and in turn were not..... and are exactly as you say ,,that they were painted white and time chipped off the paint,,and someone finishing the job of a full removal. IMO dark grips were not found as it was only a matter of a few years after their creation and the 70 some years of sunlight has not had a chance to darken to the extreme extent of total black or some deep maroon grips seen today. So dark gripped or black gripped Army and Luftwaffe daggers are not seen in period photos. It should also be taken into consideration if a dark gripped dagger is seen that the Half tones used in B&W photos will also make it appear darker.
I seen the red arrow of what your pointing at as far as the possible removal of white paint,, but still with this dagger it is not enough evidence to prove that the whole dagger itself is authentic 1st Railway.
A very easily parted together dagger from army parts and just adding a black grip!! Something like this is really worth about the price of a Regular Army dagger,,minus the authentication..but yet someone will try to put a $3000-4000 price tag on it,, because of a handful of parts. This is the hard balance with collecting these type of daggers when there is not enough information on them.
Personally I myself would choose to stay away from this type of dagger even if i did have the funds to buy it,,but i would rather walk away a rich man and be disappointed than to kick myself and find out later it is worth the price of an Army,, with the exception of the black grip. Hmmm sounds like a marriage Regards Larry

Hi,
thank you for information and I will wait for some other piece.
Mike