Mosin M91/30 PU Sniper Rifle

[GIZMO8Z]

Shouldn't be. Are the wind age and elevation knobs set to zero? It appears that you elevation at least is way high. The crosshairs looks almost bottomed out. It should be pretty close to center at that range.

Wow... I'm definitely showing my inexperience here. Neither of the knobs are actually set to zero. I'll try that tomorrow and go from there...

[MarkV]

It happens to the best of us! Forgetting to check my elevation knob during the competition cost me 20 points.

If the scope was basically zeroed during refurb, cranking the knobs to 0/0 should pretty much center the crosshairs in the field of view of the scope. It may be off slightly but my bet is that it will be close.

If there is any place where the laser bore sighters are a help is here. They really are only good for 20 to 30 yards in daylight. But, I used mine in the basement just to ensure the basic alignment of the scope to the bore. It mattered with my ex-sniper restoration because I was using a repro mount. Using the bore sighter lets you see if you have to make large adjustments using the elevation screws on the mount rail (corrections in elevation) or if you have to grind the pads on the inside of the mount (corrections in deflection left or right).

Because you are dealing with a actory refurbed rifle, your scope is probably already basically aligned. The one exception might be on the elevation side if you adjusted the screws when mounting the scope after getting the rifle. The proper technique to remount the sniper scope when it has already been sighted to the rifle is to place the mount in the rail and then tighten the top adjustment screw only. After that screw is tightened, you tighten the large thumb screw.

If, by some chance, you adjusted the bottom screw, you will have changed the elevation setting of the scope in relation to the bore. You'll know if the crosshairs are substantially high or low when you do your basic alignment by looking through the bore to the target and adjusting the scope to that same point. If it does turn out high or low - or you realize that you did adjust the lower screw - all you have to do is loosen the thumb screw and then back one screw out and tighten the other until your centered crosshairs are basically on the same point of aim as you see when looking through the bore. A laser bore sighter makes this easier and you have a positive reference point. But, you really can easily adjust the elevation screws to get close.

After you have the scope basically aligned - and again you want a sight picture with the crosshairs as close to center as possible, it is just a matter of firing some rounds and making the adjustments to the scope knobs. Once you are zeroed, you lightly loosen the two screws on each turret and gently rotate the gradient scales on the turrets to 0.

This all sounds much harder than it actually is - drop me a PM if you want to talk it through and I'll send you my phone number.

[theotherhomer]

Joe, not sure if you found anything to translate the Russian letters but I found this in a gunboards thread: http://www.pbs.org/weta/faceofrussia...c-alphabet.gif

[meyerse]

Scope is a 1943 so it goes nicely with the rifle. Next I see lots if Izhevsk markings on the parts but not Tula, so either luck or only a light refurbing was needed. I've got a 1944 tula where every part is Tula marked and so is the stock with the right date so sometimes they DID keep parts together, but they didn't worry about the original scope (the mount is original to the rifle with no cross outs either). I think you did good. I still think a 4 digit serial even on an Izhevsk is unusual no?

As to scope covers, yes, there is a guy on ebay who sells ones that look like WW2 originals.....but I'm not sure how to date them. You will often find post war ones, probably made during the refurb process, with many rifles and loose scopes that are up for sale, I have a few of these, these would be perfectly appropriate, after all your rifle was refurbed, so a refurb cover is probably okay.

THe stock is indeed a nice one, has the right mark for a Izhevsk and has the mid war open back and half liner front (earlier ones had metal slots front and back which screwed in and later after your stock then went back to metal slots but pressed in with no visable attachments). Who knows, but it at least looks like it could have lots of its original bits with it. Very cool.

So get yourself a cover and a TP-4 periscope

[GIZMO8Z]

It happens to the best of us! Forgetting to check my elevation knob during the competition cost me 20 points.

If the scope was basically zeroed during refurb, cranking the knobs to 0/0 should pretty much center the crosshairs in the field of view of the scope. It may be off slightly but my bet is that it will be close.

If there is any place where the laser bore sighters are a help is here. They really are only good for 20 to 30 yards in daylight. But, I used mine in the basement just to ensure the basic alignment of the scope to the bore. It mattered with my ex-sniper restoration because I was using a repro mount. Using the bore sighter lets you see if you have to make large adjustments using the elevation screws on the mount rail (corrections in elevation) or if you have to grind the pads on the inside of the mount (corrections in deflection left or right).

Because you are dealing with a factory refurbed rifle, your scope is probably already basically aligned. The one exception might be on the elevation side if you adjusted the screws when mounting the scope after getting the rifle. The proper technique to remount the sniper scope when it has already been sighted to the rifle is to place the mount in the rail and then tighten the top adjustment screw only. After that screw is tightened, you tighten the large thumb screw.

If, by some chance, you adjusted the bottom screw, you will have changed the elevation setting of the scope in relation to the bore. You'll know if the crosshairs are substantially high or low when you do your basic alignment by looking through the bore to the target and adjusting the scope to that same point. If it does turn out high or low - or you realize that you did adjust the lower screw - all you have to do is loosen the thumb screw and then back one screw out and tighten the other until your centered crosshairs are basically on the same point of aim as you see when looking through the bore. A laser bore sighter makes this easier and you have a positive reference point. But, you really can easily adjust the elevation screws to get close.

After you have the scope basically aligned - and again you want a sight picture with the crosshairs as close to center as possible, it is just a matter of firing some rounds and making the adjustments to the scope knobs. Once you are zeroed, you lightly loosen the two screws on each turret and gently rotate the gradient scales on the turrets to 0.

This all sounds much harder than it actually is - drop me a PM if you want to talk it through and I'll send you my phone number.

Hi Mark, Thank you so much for the info. I've been so busy and haven't had much chance to play with my new sniper. Stupid me... I wasn't aware that there was a proper way to attach the scope. I just attached the mount to the rail, tightened the big screw/ matched up the two witness marks on the rail and big screw that I matched up.



I found one for sale locally and for cheap... so I picked up a 7.62x54r laser bore sight. All I did was set the two knobs on the scope to 0/0 and tighten the thumb screw, I didn't mess with anything else... BUT It looks like the cross hairs are a little high... Is this ok?

A little faint, but you can see the laser pointer at the center of the cross hairs.


M91/30 Mosin laser rifle... pew pew!

[GIZMO8Z]

Joe, not sure if you found anything to translate the Russian letters but I found this in a gunboards thread: http://www.pbs.org/weta/faceofrussia...c-alphabet.gif

Thanks!

Scope is a 1943 so it goes nicely with the rifle. Next I see lots if Izhevsk markings on the parts but not Tula, so either luck or only a light refurbing was needed. I've got a 1944 tula where every part is Tula marked and so is the stock with the right date so sometimes they DID keep parts together, but they didn't worry about the original scope (the mount is original to the rifle with no cross outs either). I think you did good. I still think a 4 digit serial even on an Izhevsk is unusual no?

As to scope covers, yes, there is a guy on ebay who sells ones that look like WW2 originals.....but I'm not sure how to date them. You will often find post war ones, probably made during the refurb process, with many rifles and loose scopes that are up for sale, I have a few of these, these would be perfectly appropriate, after all your rifle was refurbed, so a refurb cover is probably okay.

THe stock is indeed a nice one, has the right mark for a Izhevsk and has the mid war open back and half liner front (earlier ones had metal slots front and back which screwed in and later after your stock then went back to metal slots but pressed in with no visable attachments). Who knows, but it at least looks like it could have lots of its original bits with it. Very cool.

So get yourself a cover and a TP-4 periscope

Thanks for the kind words! I also believe the rifle was lightly refurbished... I see nothing but Izhevsk on it and it just feels pretty unmolested.

I got scope cover incoming... I just need a nice sling for it!

Oh... I also need to find some time to go shoot this beauty of course... I wish there were more hours in the day!

[MarkV]

Joe,

It looks to me as if your sight is aligned both high and left. What are the settings on the elevation and windage knobs to get the crosshairs aligned with the dot? I'm surprised with the alignment issue since these rifles were gross-scale aligned before going into storage. It "should" be close. Before we screw something up, make sure that there is nothing on the inside of the mount or the rail - like some old cosmoline, etc and that the small alignment screws on the rail are tight against the mount.

If, after you check all that, the sight picture is the same, then you have some adjustment to do. Before we go through all that, though, check to make sure everything is as I noted above and let me know. The adjustments, even if needed, aren't that hard - I had to do the same with my repro sniper since those scopes were not aligned at the factory.

[GIZMO8Z]

Joe,

It looks to me as if your sight is aligned both high and left. What are the settings on the elevation and windage knobs to get the crosshairs aligned with the dot? I'm surprised with the alignment issue since these rifles were gross-scale aligned before going into storage. It "should" be close. Before we screw something up, make sure that there is nothing on the inside of the mount or the rail - like some old cosmoline, etc and that the small alignment screws on the rail are tight against the mount.

If, after you check all that, the sight picture is the same, then you have some adjustment to do. Before we go through all that, though, check to make sure everything is as I noted above and let me know. The adjustments, even if needed, aren't that hard - I had to do the same with my repro sniper since those scopes were not aligned at the factory.

Thanks for being such an amazing help, Mark! I reset both knobs to zero like you suggested a few days back. If I remember correctly, windage is still set at zero, while elevation is set less than one notch from zero which brought the cross hairs up higher to meet up with the red dot.

I'm hoping that the issue may have something to do me trying to line up my cellphone to snap a picture of the scope... it's actually pretty tricky! You'll notice that you can also see my rifle's front iron sight thru the scope in the photo I snapped... not sure, but I think you can't normally see them with the naked eye.

[GIZMO8Z]

Hi Mark,

In an effort to make things a little more simple for me, I went ahead and edited this picture. I'm sorry I'm so inexperienced and simple minded when it comes to this...

When my rifle arrived, the scope came pre-attached to the mount and it seemed like it was pretty sturdy. I also noticed that faint witness marks on the scope lined up to witness marks on top of the mount so I didn't want to mess with things.

I admit that save for taking a Q-Tip and cleaning out the screw driver slot in each screw, I have not touched any of the screws numbered 1-4 in this photo. I also have not messed with the tiny screws on the scope windage and elevation knobs.

The only thing I've done is hand tightened the thumb screw circled in green and then used my Mosin multi tool to tighten the thumb screw so that the witness mark on the thumb screw matched the corresponding witness mark on the rail, which I also marked in green.

I am assuming that I need to make sure that screws #1-4 need to be tight... If I still have a problem, what screw(s) will need attention?



I need to find a local Mosin expert. Mark, how would you like to move into the spare room in my apartment... I can offer you 5meals a week in the campus dining hall and an endless supply of 7.62x54r and .30 carbine.

[MarkV]

Joe,

As much as I'd love to join you, I think I'll stay here where I can shoot from my back porch!

For the adjustment, only screws 1 & 2 are involved - 3 & 4(&5 since there are 2 screws on the rear ring) should already be tight. The winess marks will help in case you ever need to remove the scope from the mount.

So, first thing is to properly seat the mount - using screws 1 & 2 and the thumb screw. Assuming you have not yet touched 1 & 2, loosen the thumb screw and then use a screw driver to tighten 1. That should lock the mount into position and then retighten the thumb screw.

Then, turn the windage and elevation knobs to "0" - did that put the crosshairs close to center?

After that, we will have options on making the needed adjustments - it it will be dependent on whether you've already adjusted 1&2 before this and what the sight picture looks like after you zero the knobs.

I'm thinking it will be easier to move this to a phone conversation. I will PM you with my number and we can talk later.