Sten Gun Mk1*

[Mick]

If I could have measurements from your replica that would be great ! That and some detailed photos would give me a good idea of what I need to build.

With the above I should have a MkI* built, and a video of it being test fired posted here within three months.

Thanks Nige

PS, MkII test fire.

[Nige H]

Hi Mick,
I do have some other information around somewhere relating to parts which are Mk1 only, but I'll have to hunt around for the documentation, as my replica was built some years ago now and so I'll have to have a think about were I put everything. As to my Sten, again it not actually to hand at the moment, the reason is that it has been on loan to a local museum for about three years, as part of a display to do with the generic history of the Sten gun series. So I will take some more detail pictures and measurements for you when I can get over there and get access into the display cabinet.

Nige.

[Mick]

Hi Nige,

That would be great if you could dig out what you have. In the meantime I emailed the Imperial War Museum asking if they have blue prints that they could let me have a copy of. I notice that the magwell collar on your example looks to have a thicker wall that the only other one that I have seen a picture of. Whether the other one (pictured below ) is a proper Mk1* or not I could not say. Apart from this measurement the detail that mystifies me is the muzzle end of the gun. I'm sure it's nothing complex but without knowing how it was put together originally it will be difficult to come up with a decent reproduction.

[Mick]

Hi Nige, I have a few questions I think you will be able to answer without going to the museum. I hope you don't mind.

The Mk1* pictured above has a simplified front sight compared with yours, is this normal ?

I notice that your replica has screws in the magwell collar. Do these screws hold the collar in place ?

Does your replica have a MkII style ejector or a MkIII style ?

Please explain how the barrel is secured in place.

Thanks

[Nige H]

Hi Nige, I have a few questions I think you will be able to answer without going to the museum. I hope you don't mind.

The Mk1* pictured above has a simplified front sight compared with yours, is this normal ?

Mick I think its just the angle of the picture, the front sight blade (not visible in your photo) is welded to the sight protector, then is ether welded or rivet onto the tube. The sight protect is a one piece stamping, with follows the profile of the tube, with the side uprights being a 90 degree fold from the base, the attachment "Tabs" are the two pieces of metal which have been stamped out to form the inverted "U" shape of the sides, again I made mine by hand as the chances of find one of these are near impossible.

I notice that your replica has screws in the mag well collar. Do these screws hold the collar in place ?

Yes these hold the sleeve to the breech bushing, they are in fact rivet on the real gun, I used screws on mine due to the fact that I need to strip the gun down when I get around to it, to do the Blank firing conversion. At that point I will lead in the slots of the screw heads, to give them the correct look. The Mk1's I seen ether have domed rivets (early Mk1 production) or flattened head rivets (Mk1*), plus also a lot of Mk1's were rebuilt to Mk1* specification some time after 1942 which what I opted to replicate.

Does your replica have a Mk II style ejector or a Mk III style ?

The ejector is Mk1 specific but is similar to the Mk3, I'll see if I can find my original paperwork, as it maybe the overall length of the part that differs, again this could be down to the Mk1 series bolts being different to Sten models 2,3,& 5. Personally I'd use a Mk2 bolt and then workout the overall length of the part from that.

Please explain how the barrel is secured in place.

The tube is similar to the Mk3, the front barrel bushing is in two parts, the outer section with the flat bar shape (as seen in your picture above) is welded to the front of the tubular body. The inner barrel bushing is the piece that has the sling swivel is part of, this is a push fit into the outer part of the bushing. The flat bar section has two machine screws (one each side) the screws go half way through the side walls of the inner bushings, and then back thorough into the block section of the outer. The barrel is under cut on the end (as per Mk3) so that once the inner bushing is screwed fully in place it holds the barrel via this under cut shoulder at the front, at the back by the standard ring into the breech bushing at the back.

Thanks

No problem


P.S.
The mag well is metric tube not imperial, (you cant buy imperial tube in the U.K. anymore) so that why it looks a little different however the wall thickness is about the same, so again maybe the angle of the picture. Also the Mk1* in your photo looks as if it got a Mk2 sleeve which has been modified.

Some Mk2's have Mk1 barrels, most people think this is for a Gucci type muzzle brake, or compensator arrangement but in fact the real truth is there just left over stock which was not used during Mk1 production LOL.


Nige.

[Mick]

That's very helpful Nige.

The barrel bushing is even less complex than I thought, I just need measurements and photos of the bushing and the underside of the receiver tube to be able to replicate the original. The measurements of the cocking handle and would also be usefull to know.

I always thought the the MkII's you refer to had mkIII barrels, I did not realise they were MkI's.

I found a photo online ( even photos are hard to find ) that shows the flat rivets you mention, they will be easy to replicate.



The magwell tubes contract when welded. I start with a tubes that are too big for the receiver, but they fit when finished.

[Nige H]

Hi Mick,
well if your already making mag housing then your over half way there, the problem I've found when talking about this with guys in the States, most buy the kits and then rebuild them, when in fact a Sten is so simple you can build the whole thing from scratch. Its also interesting to see from your new picture that this original Mk1 mag housing is welded down the front face, again the ones I've owned on my Mk2 and Mk5 Sten's, the housings was just welded along the top and bottom, so yet again I did mine the same way. Finally I say this, for some reason the Mk1 series has a lot of different parts, which are made in a slightly different way over the duration of the production period why they messed around with this model so much I don't know, the only thing I can think of is that they were trying out different ways of making the parts to reduce cost and manufacturing time.


Nige.

[Mick]

I've made lots of magwells, and many other parts. Most of this was done with hand tools, but I'm now getting the machinery together to speed things up. I have a new milling machine coming next week. All I need to do now is to learn how to use it

I have seen MkII and MkIII stens made and welded every way possible, I think it just depended on the factory and ultimately the mood of the person doing the work at the time.

[Mick]

Nige,

I have managed to get hold of some detailed Mk1 photos, all I'm short of is measurements of the barrel bushings.

I take it the Mk1* has nothing to stop the barrel spinning ?

[Nige H]

Hi Mick
I'll have to get access to my Sten for the other info you want, as to the barrel no there nothing to stop it twisting, its fully floating between the breech and muzzle bushings, the original drawings I have show no lug, cut out or pin type of arrangement to prevent any twist. The barrel is under cut at both the breech and the muzzle, so maybe they were relying on the pressure of the barrel being held between the two bushings once the gun was fully assemble and the front bush, screwed in place to prevent it turning.

Nige.