Got a pic of my ggd help identify

**WillC** · 07-16-2014, 04:05 AM

Before he was sent out to Yugoslavia, he was on leave. This is the photo of him before he left on the train. What are those stripes on the arms? Any significance? Next photo

Hes wearing the SS runes btw, it's kinda blurry. Which SS divisions wore the SS runes? I know some volunteer divisions did, and some wore symbols etc. Any help is appreciated.

**Espenlaub Militaria** · 07-16-2014 04:05 AM

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**M18922** · 07-16-2014, 05:07 AM

The stripes indicate der Spiess.

**WillC** · 07-16-2014, 05:18 AM

What's Der Spiess?

**WillC** · 07-16-2014, 05:23 AM

Well my mom told me something quite cool today, she says she has my great grand dads Edelweiss patch. I'm so glad that survived.

**Fallschirmjager1941** · 07-16-2014, 05:27 AM

Spiess is a rank equivalent to a U.S. army first sergeant. Often Der Spiess was known as "the father of the company" due to the fact that candidates were usually older or more experienced NCOs.

Hope this helped.

**WillC** · 07-16-2014, 05:31 AM

He was Oberscharfuhrer, thanks for the response.

**Jerry B** · 07-16-2014, 06:49 AM

Is he also wearing an alte kampfe (old guard) chevron on his right sleeve?

**HPL2008** · 07-16-2014, 07:10 AM

Both photographs show him as a JNCO with the Waffen-SS, with no distinctive unit insignia seen in either image.
Basically, and slightly simplified, SS rune collar patches were worn by (most) German/Germanic W-SS formations, while (most) ethnic/foreign/volunteer formations wore special collar patches (or blank ones, if a distinctive collar patch had not or not yet been authorized). German cadre personnel serving with foreign units were to wear those units' collar patches, but often retained the runic ones. If he really was with Skanderbeg (as mentioned in another thread), this practice was to be expected, all the more so as the special collar patch for that division - while definitely authorized and manufactured - is generally believed to have remained unissued.

His rank in the second photograph is Unterscharführer, the lowest NCO rank.
He is wearing the Ehrenwinkel für alte Kämpfer [Honor chevron for old fighters] on his right sleeve. This indicated membership in the Nazi party or one of its organizations (such as the HJ, SA, SS etc.) prior to the Nazis' seizure of power in 1933, or, for Austrians, prior to the Austrian annexation in 1938. (We have found out in another thread that he was Austrian.)

The first photo was apparently taken later. Rank is still Unterscharführer, but the twin Tresse rings on his sleeves show that he now holds the duty position (not rank) colloquially known as Spieß.
The official SS designation for this duty position was Stabsscharführer if held by one of the two highest NCO ranks and Stabsscharführerdiensttuer [i.e. acting Stabsscharführer] if held by a lower rank such as in this case.
Added to his right sleeve is now the mountain troops' Edelweiß badge.

Finally, a word of advice: You keep starting new threads about your great-grandfather. It would make much more sense to keep all the material and requests for information in a single thread.