Alcoso Army Officers Dagger
Alcoso Army officers dagger in fair condition blade is nice but is in the scabbard backwards I know this can be indicator of a parts dagger but I believe this one is OK I would turn it around but the pommel cap is tight and could break the top handle I done this once so will leave it as aquired. I had over 30 daggers about all organizations in the 1980's until I found out my high end pieces HJ Leader, Chained SS etc were parts daggers I got out of them I aquired this one from collector friend several years ago and will keep it it is one of the few I own as I am not a dagger guy anymore have taken up other items of interest. So this dagger fits well with my Army Items. timothy
08-08-2013 07:46 PM
Nice dagger Tim! It's not unusual to find these with the MM on the front side according to the evidence in the link below. It's also interesting to see that the pommel cap and crossguard on these Coppel daggers is slightly magnetic, apparently that's unique to that maker.
A. Coppel Alcoso
'I do not think we can hope for any better thing now.
We shall stick it out to the end, but we are getting weaker of course, and the end cannot be far.
It seems a pity, but I do not think I can write more. R. SCOTT.
Last Entry - For God's sake look after our people.'
In memory of Capt. Robert Falcon Scott, Edward Wilson, Henry Bowers, Lawrence Oates and Edgar Evans. South Pole Expedition, 30th March 1912.
Unfortunately it is a part Herr dagger.
Blade belongs to 4. ACS type dagger, and a your dagger is your 3. type.
(Such mixed daggers was assembled from unfinished dagger, and sold to Allied soldiers as souvenirs, after WW2.)
In addition, these dagger is terrible cleaned, missing the entire surface layer.
The correct Herr ASC dagger third and 4 type:
(Photos are not my property)
A dagger with lots of character. It is not unusual to see the maker mark on the front of the dagger. Alcoso daggers are frequently found with "frozen" pommels. Forcing it could result in a broken tang. There really is no reason to disassemble the dagger, you are wise to leave it as is.
I have no trouble accepting this dagger. It is indeed a 3rd model crossguard, but not the final makers mark usually found on the "high lift" eagle with the fourth model guard (AWS). The ACS version is not impossible on this dagger. I don't see the dagger as having been cleaned, the finish and patina seem correct for the "eisenkopf" type crossguard. These are of course just my personal opinions, others may disagree.
Hello dear friend, Wehrmacht officer dagger which is shown on this thread is very nice conditioned textbook ALCOSO product. Pommel, crossguard (3rd.type), blade with "ACS" and horizontally placed scales mark (5th. type mark) is correct for this dagger, including scabbard. This dagger is not partial! Sorry for my words, I certainly donīt want to be rude, but it is a shame to say that textbook dagger, which is correct to every way is "partial".
Wolfgang you are correct in every way!
I have to say my opinion:
Alcoso was one of the largest producer of edged weapons during the Third Reich, he produced daggers in very good quality. His first mark - scales only - (I show picture of it above) was used in very short time and we find it only on daggers which had first and second corssguards. Next is more common trademark - scales and title "A L C O S O" (I also show it below), next marker mark which I donīt show is scales and elegant script "Alcoso", this both marker marks can be find on 3rd. crossguard. And finally horizontal scales with mark "ACS" and elegant script "Alcoso", (which I show below too) can be find on 3rd. crossguard (dagger shows on this thread and above) and 4th. crossguard too! Last mark "AWS" can be find on 3rd. and 4th. crossguard also. I add photo of my Luftwaffe dagger 2nd. model, because I donīt have army dagger with this mark, but it certainly helps.
Friends I donīt want to be offensive, but I have to say my opinion, sorry for my English, I know it is not perfect, hope you understand If Iīm wrong, or if I did a mistake, or forgot something Feel free to say your opinion - Iīm not perfect, and I always learn something about my main interest - Wehrmacht daggers!
Each dagger shows below is in my collection.
PeterCollector, you are in no way offending anyone. Different points of view are valuable if discussed with respect for others opinions. You obviously have a great deal of knowledge regarding these daggers, I am looking forward to more of your comments. I still have much to learn. It is nice to find other collectors who love the Heer daggers.
I don't think it is a parts dagger I had some army parts daggers in the 80 usually mismatched cross guards, sheaths, blades all kinds of things this one is all Alcoso as it should be I am inclined to believe in Wolfeknife's theory as I have seen a lot of original daggers from vets like this one or at least all the pieces were made by the same maker not mismatched. It was interesting to see that the logo was sometimes in the front by Alcoso as posted eariler in this thread. Parts daggers was the reason I got out of them in the first place. I know WKC put the Logo on Dress bayonets on the Obverse or front of the blade instead of the Reverse so it could been seen (See Seitengewher by George Wheeler) Like to hear from some others on this. timothy
I see nothing the matter with this Army dagger. It has been disassembled and put back together wrong years ago-likely by the GI or his family that brought it back. The pummel was over tightened in the process and it has since frozen into place. It could Possibly be gently coaxed into loosening up, but, as said, you take the dire chance of shattering the grip and possibly even snapping off the tip of the tang, so I would advise leaving it be. It could do with a very soft clean, but overall, I would simply keep it as is.
"Much that once was, is lost. For none now live who remember it."
Hello Wolfgang, thanks for your comment. I forgot, for alcoso (but other markers also) is typical to fix pommels in place on army (but 2nd. model luftwaffe also). Only 2nd. patent dagger from alcoso was not fixed in place. So be extremely careful with 1st., 3rd. and 4th. patents, you can easily damaged them! I have 3rd. patent dagger from alcoso, but it is not magnetic, in my opinion 3rd. patent magnetic daggers were only early examples.