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help identify these helmets please

Article about: hi - could anyone help identify these helmets ? I think they're Russian / Soviet but not sure any help would be greatly appreciated

  1. #1

    Default help identify these helmets please

    hi - could anyone help identify these helmets ? I think they're Russian / Soviet but not sure



    any help would be greatly appreciated
    Click to enlarge the picture Click to enlarge the picture help identify these helmets please   help identify these helmets please  

    help identify these helmets please   help identify these helmets please  

    help identify these helmets please   help identify these helmets please  

    help identify these helmets please   help identify these helmets please  


  2. #2

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    MkIV british "turtle" helmet

  3. #3

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    As already stated, these are MkIII/IV 'turtle' helmets, the pattern that succeeded the Mk2 Brodie. It saw use with the British army from 1944 onwards, and was used for many years afterwards.

    There are ways to differentiate between wartime and postwar versions, but it's not something I've ever studied personally. I'm sure the resident helmet experts will be able to elaborate.

    Regards, B.B.
    ''Everyday you think of living. We are born to die, but I appreciate life. We live day by day, and I always say: yesterday is history, today's reality, and tomorrow's a dream.' -- Henry Flescher, Holocaust Survivor -- March 14, 1924 - August 29, 2018

  4. #4
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    Inside the longer part of the helmet you should be able to find a date or a series of numbers that could be a date. Very few of these were not dated but sometimes the paint was to thick to see it.

  5. #5

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    " but it's not something I've ever studied personally."

    Me neither BB, but the chin strap may be a clue, I believe with the brass end crimp it is a post war strap.

  6. #6

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    I've been trying to start ONE thread on this helmet....you may find it helpful

    British Mark IV Mk4 "Turtle" helmet

    This was Britains attempt to fix the problems of side and neck protection which the MkII Tommy helmet had....the MkI / MkII was primarily to protect from falling objects but as they saw from the US M1 model better side/rear protection was advantageous. This new shape, designated the MkIII was first used near the end of the war....the first iteration had a hole in the crown for a liner attachment screw/nut and the strap retaining lugs were fitted further up the helmet...a hole and high rivets usually = MkIII. The Mk4, these ones, had a "Lift-the-dot" (effectively a quick release tab on the liner) removable liner which sat over a small post installed in the crown...this effectively sealed the shell allowing it to be used to hold water. They also had strap lug rivets nearer the rim, as these do. There were a few upgraded Mk3s which have a post retrofitted into the liner hole so those shells can receive the new style LTD liner...so you can get them with MkIII stamps (usually inner long end) but liners of Mk4. And then they threw in a new liner, a new style inner frame, more padding, a head "sock" comforter...but still one central helmet fitment screw/nut in an attempt to make it more stable......there's been debates whether this sexed-up Mk4 was ever officially called a Mark 5 (as, after all, the helmet itself didn't change) but the fact that the next helmet issued, the first "plastic" one, was designated the Mk6 kinda suggests that someone somewhere felt the new liner justified a new number....

    The helmet SHAPE saw action in late WW2, throughout Korea, right thru the Ireland "troubles" and, of course, in the Falklands. They're usually referred to as "Turtle" helmets after their original designer Doctor Algernon Winfield Turtle.

    There's loads of other info out there about shell colours, texturing, visors, flashes etc etc......

    Oh...and I lied about the Algernon....it's because of the shell shape.....obvs.......

  7. #7
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    "They're usually referred to as "Turtle" helmets after their original designer Doctor Algernon Winfield Turtle."
    Your're such an cad

    You do realise all over the internet from now on, that Algernon, will always be remembered as the man who designed the Mk3/4

  8. #8

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    yep...sorry about that...'good job no ones likely to confuse ol' Algernon with David Virtus MSC...........or Francois Felin........or Mark Sicks.....geddit?!! :-)

  9. #9

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    hi many thanks for your help - I was barking up the wrong tree when I thought they were soviet !!

    marking inside are - ROC 4 HV? MA 1952

    AND 4 HV K1952 ? these ones may not be correct as paint makes hard to read


    any info on what these markings mean ?

  10. #10

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    ....'never cared too much about the making of the bloomin' things but obviously there's dates in there...most, if not all are '52 or some '53s

    ROC will be RO&Co or ROCO.......Rubery Owen and Co Ltd...a maker of MkII and MkIII/IV steel shells...not sure about "AND" but they'll be a maker too...someone will be along shortly...it could be the part of the body which made it....geddit? :-)

    Pairs of letters like the HV and/or the MA will probably be the batch number from which the steel came from....it usually is....but I may be wrong

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