Signs of a fake Brodie?

**TomDelahoyde** · 08-07-2018, 10:19 AM

Hi all, I am relatively new to helmet collecting and I have gone with Civil Defence helmets and I am wondering is there really fake Brodies about?? I know there are lots fake German helmets but I never thought about fake Brodies.

What are the signs of a fake?

Many Thanks,
Tom

**Jb4046** · 08-07-2018, 10:24 AM

There isn’t many fake helmets I would assume . But there is a lot of helmets that get repainted To fool you. It could be post war helmets made to look like civil defence helmets or army. Or even civil defence helmets painted to look like army helmets. Some army helmets get “upgraded” with fake flashes

Here is my own example of a fake ARP helmet I bought and stripped back the paint to reveal a post war Belgium helmet
Saving a Belgium mark 2 helmet

**TomDelahoyde** · 08-07-2018, 10:27 AM

Nice discovery, I’m surprised the decal survived under the black paint

**BrodieBartfast** · 08-07-2018, 10:29 AM

There are, but reproduction shells are usually fairly obvious. It is far more common to encounter genuine helmets with fake embellishments such as flashes for rare or prestigious units. When it comes to Home Front helmets, there are plenty with fake lettering hanging about. Usually it's pretty easy to identify them, as the painted letters will show a good deal less wear and tear and patina than the rest of the helmet. In effect, they look 'new' in comparison to the rest of the lid.

One way to identify this is to look at scratches and rust close to the lettering. If the paint passes over these, it is likely it was added postwar. Case in point; my senior warden's helmet here. Note the gouges in the paint, and the way they pass through the 'W' rather than under it.

It's always safer, if unsure, to go for helmets with more wear and tear, as any fake lettering will be easier to spot. It is very difficult, if not impossible, for fakers to make new lettering on a rusty lid look convincing. Of course, there will always be exceptions to the rule. And there are some genuine Home Front helmets around today that are in such good shape that they look brand new. If you're ever uncertain, you can always post your prospective purchase here first. We have several Home Front helmet experts who will be able to help you out.

Regards, B.B.

**HARRY THE MOLE** · 08-07-2018, 12:26 PM

by BrodieBartfast

One way to identify this is to look at scratches and rust close to the lettering. If the paint passes over these, it is likely it was added postwar. Case in point; my senior warden's helmet here. Note the gouges in the paint, and the way they pass through the 'W' rather than under it.

Regards, B.B.

Brodie... the black paint on your helmet looks as though it is actually applied OVER the two gouges in the 'W'... as does the white too. Now there could be a variety of reasons for this, and of course I am only passing my judgement based upon what I see in the pictures.

**BrodieBartfast** · 08-07-2018, 01:11 PM

Whatever impacted the helmet to cause the gouges looks to have dented the paint rather than scrape it away. It's possible that the damage is to an earlier coat of paint underneath, which was painted over when it was turned into a senior warden's lid. It's a lot more clear 'in-hand' than it is in the photos, but it's definitely kosher.

Regards, B.B.

**HoundsTooth** · 08-07-2018, 04:16 PM

Look out for member 'Composite' - he's a massive fan of home front helmets.
In fact, I believe he will be releasing a book soon - probably be in the top 10 in WH Smith - right Ade???

**Jerry B** · 08-07-2018, 04:54 PM

by HARRY THE MOLE

Brodie... the black paint on your helmet looks as though it is actually applied OVER the two gouges in the 'W'... as does the white too. Now there could be a variety of reasons for this, and of course I am only passing my judgement based upon what I see in the pictures.

I agree, the W looks to be added over the scratches from the pic shown!

**BrodieBartfast** · 08-07-2018, 05:39 PM

The original thread for the helmet is here: Chief Warden's Helmet

I'd guess that it was painted over damage the helmet sustained in whatever prior role it had, likely a general Home Front lid. The factory coat appears to be green, going on the interior colour.

B.B.

**Composite** · 08-07-2018, 05:54 PM

You can all argue the toss till the cows come home.......painted scratches...or scratched paint??? Personally I get nervous about painted scratches BUT these things took a load of stick at the time and re-touching was de rigour.....also, Helmets were upgraded as their wearers were and this too triggered re-paints......the Helmets themselves are almost always “right” (not always though)....and it’s all down to the paintwork. As has already been said....most of it comes down to does it LOOK old / right.....I’ve got a few which, in my opinion, are “wrong”...and then in 3 months time they’ll be “right”......and at W&P I argued with one of the country’s most knowledgeable Brit Helmet experts about the authenticity of a couple of Home Fronters.......80+ years of experience and we still didn’t agree!!!

...and yes, there’s said to be a book coming out this year...... but don’t hold your breath if you’re hoping it’ll tell you any more about paint-dating than this post.....I know the authors!