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Dienstmütze der DJ Führerschaft

Article about: the Dienstmütze der DJ Führerschaft was introduced in 1938,They were made of a lighter and better quality material and are stiffer than the HJ ski cap on which the design was based and they

  1. #1

    Default Dienstmütze der DJ Führerschaft

    the Dienstmütze der DJ Führerschaft was introduced in 1938,They were made of a lighter and better quality material and are stiffer than the HJ ski cap on which the design was based and they replaced the "DJ Führermütze" that had been introduced in 1936.This earlier cap was exactly the same as the DJ winter cap and the HJ ski cap but with the difference that the aluminium braid was added and that it was worn with the eagle instead of the HJ diamond. There were two versions, one with a gold braid and the other with an aluminium braid, The former was worn by Jungbannführer and Gebiet staff members of the rank of Jungbannführer and higher. The version with gold braid was worn by those on the RJF staff with the rank of Jungbannführer and higher.


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    silas

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  3. #2

    Default

    Wow, that's an almost word for word copy & paste from a 2012 post here:

    Deutsches Jungvolk cap for leaders (DJ Führermütze) - Hitler Youth Militaria Collector Forum - Page 3

    Some call that plagiarism. How about crediting the author/website where you found your information...

  4. #3

    Default

    At the HJ forum other caps are shown, I think.
    If I remember well the tags there were brown. Here it is an early white tag.
    "Wir sollen auch unser Leben für die Brüder lassen" (1.Joh.3.16):
    zum Gedächtnis Wilhelm Schenk. Er starb fürs Vaterland am 13. Juni 1916

  5. #4

    Default

    Quote by Wilhelm Saris View Post
    At the HJ forum other caps are shown, I think.
    If I remember well the tags there were brown. Here it is an early white tag.
    Hi, I don't mean the pictures but rather the text. It's almost an exact copy of the post at the HJ Research forum. I just think it would be good form for "overthetop" to credit the source.

  6. #5

    Default

    Quote by Norku32 View Post
    Hi, I don't mean the pictures but rather the text. It's almost an exact copy of the post at the HJ Research forum. I just think it would be good form for "overthetop" to credit the source.
    Do let me say as one here with thousands of posts that have been re used by others without citations, as a rule there is little new knowledge and a lot of it is reused.
    I am a professional historian held to a very high standard as regards the quality of my scholarly work as read by professional scholars. The standard here is not really
    the same, nor does it have to be. In our world, we can cut and paste to our heart's content, and we serve more the needs of the casually interested and so forth.
    For young people, the cut and paste what you find is normal, and reveals a sense of knowledge which is perhaps less comfortable to me, who learned with pencils,
    note cards, microfilm, and for whom it was impossible to lift entire texts with no citation with a single click...

    In one case a person here used my material without citing me, and I raised a stink, but my goal is really to attract as much knowledge as possible.
    This site is also not the subsidiary of any other site in any form or measure.
    We are very glad that Wim works here with us, and helps us.

    Thousands of images of my collection, which took me fifty years of hard work and a very, very large sum of cash to amass, are freely and promiscuously recycled,
    but that is exactly why I put them here, so they would be used by others to show authentic items.

    So what?

    As concerns civility and such, the lack of proper form of citations, etc. is less a concern of mine than the the creeping intrusion of uncivil and aggressive behavior
    that has risen in the last year.

    I do not mean to kibbitz on Bob Coleman's space, but he is a close friend and he and I work very closely with the Adrian Stevenson and the other moderators to
    assure the proper form and style of this place.
    Last edited by Friedrich-Berthold; 09-02-2016 at 11:21 PM.
    damit, basta.

  7. #6

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    Last edited by Friedrich-Berthold; 09-03-2016 at 04:40 PM.
    damit, basta.

  8. #7

    Default

    Quote by Friedrich-Berthold View Post
    Do let me say as one here with thousands of posts that have been re used by others without citations, as a rule there is little new knowledge and a lot of it is reused.
    I am a professional historian held to a very high standard as regards the quality of my scholarly work as read by professional scholars. The standard here is not really
    the same, nor does it have to be. In our world, we can cut and paste to our heart's content, and we serve more the needs of the casually interested and so forth.
    For young people, the cut and paste what you find is normal, and reveals a sense of knowledge which is perhaps less comfortable to me, who learned with pencils,
    note cards, microfilm, and for whom it was impossible to lift entire texts with no citation with a single click...

    In one case a person here used my material without citing me, and I raised a stink, but my goal is really to attract as much knowledge as possible.
    This site is also not the subsidiary of any other site in any form or measure.
    We are very glad that Wim works here with us, and helps us.

    Thousands of images of my collection, which took me fifty years of hard work and a very, very large sum of cash to amass, are freely and promiscuously recycled,
    but that is exactly why I put them here, so they would be used by others to show authentic items.

    So what?

    As concerns civility and such, the lack of proper form of citations, etc. is less a concern of mine than the the creeping intrusion of uncivil and aggressive behavior
    that has risen in the last year.

    I do not mean to kibbitz on Bob Coleman's space, but he is a close friend and he and I work very closely with the Adrian Stevenson and the other moderators to
    assure the proper form and style of this place.
    With all due respect, this isn't about me or you or our respective approach to the study of collectibles/history. I am not pushing "overthetop" to produce a scientific paper with citations/footnotes. I am simply reminding him that it is common courtesy to credit the source when the information presented has been copied and pasted. As an academic, you will understand the merits of exposing oneself to as many sources of information as possible. Warrelics is a good forum overall but the HJ section here can never truly compete with a dedicated HJ forum which is why I was keen to provide the link which "overthetop" did not.

    Quote by Friedrich-Berthold View Post
    As concerns civility and such, the lack of proper form of citations, etc. is less a concern of mine than the the creeping intrusion of uncivil and aggressive behavior
    that has risen in the last year.
    Our opinions differ on this. Forced civility can lead to the stifling of potentially useful conversation. Sometimes things need to be hammered out and it is in the interest of history and the study of collectibles that this sometimes be allowed.

  9. #8

    Default

    I think "Overthetop" copied the text in his "innocence" and not to make
    a mistake about the meaning of such cap. Just like that. I think it is
    harmless. Yes, he could have made a proper "credit", but isn't it so that
    we all have our imperfections? Also at the HJ-forum they have them!

    By the way the text was copied from a post by Garry (Marschall)!

    The announcement about the DJ leaders cap, as published in the
    "Verordnungsblatt Reichsjugendführung der NSDAP (HJ)" IV/5
    from February 10, 1936. Page 27.

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    The additional information as published in the "Amtliches Nachrichtenblatt
    des Jugendführers des Deutschen Reichs und der Reichsjugendführung
    der NSDAP
    ", Sonderdruck 7/38 from September 30, 1938. Page 14:

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    Both text-parts are in German, if someone thinks it is needed to translate,
    please do so! The cap is anyway a look-a-like for the DJ winter-cap and
    HJ skiing-cap.

    The HJ winter-cap in contrary to the DJ leaders cap from HJ-forum:

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    "Wir sollen auch unser Leben für die Brüder lassen" (1.Joh.3.16):
    zum Gedächtnis Wilhelm Schenk. Er starb fürs Vaterland am 13. Juni 1916

  10. #9

    Default

    I can see both sides of the ball here and will leave it at that.

    I saw no wrong doing by OvertheTop as he made no claim to the photos posted or the items in the photos and yes all of us are guilty of some sort of plagiarism even if it is one line seen in text..or repeated in verbal conversation. No Doubt

    yet................

    Im also a firm believer to give credit where it is due especially coming from competing militaria sites and also within this very website.
    I have practiced this courtesy from the greatest of teachers here..and have found it disciplining in a positive sense being congenial. I have practiced this over the years mostly in the dagger forum with giving credit to the GDC. Geman Daggers Community , Axis History Forum and the WAF...including Authors of great works and within.

    I do have to say to OverTheTop ..that it would be regarded with integrity to give credit where it is due... if most of the text was from another listed source....
    and ......

    To Friedrich.....you are One of those great teachers that has taught me civility which I gained more of when I came to the WarRelics Forum .
    A Great Reason why this forum is driven and has a great Unity within the Community.

    The Thread starter posts an HJ cap to be shared on this forum. I have been a witness of many same old things being posted and no longer doubt that with the advanced minds here who study and research these things..always seem to find a glint more of something never seen before. Most of the arm chair aficionados who say the hobby is dead and the artifact has already been talked about......... NOT TRUE.

    There is always something to discuss when those who never give up in study . There is still Wood in the Woodwork

    Regards Larry
    It is not the size of a Collection in History that matters......Its the size of your Passion for it!! - Larry C

    One never knows what tree roots push to the surface of what laid buried before the tree was planted - Larry C

    “The farther back you can look, the farther forward you are likely to see.” - Winston Churchill

  11. #10
    CBH
    CBH is offline
    ?

    Default

    Norku what is it to you ? Did you write the article or post ? Is it your hat ? I didn't think this was a doctorate class where plagiarism is an offence . It's the internet where almost anything goes , two of the best collectors and posters on this site said it's fine , so go relax . Work on a non-bitchy post .
    Cheers Chris

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