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Cargo Submarine U-Deutschland Artifacts and Model

Article about: Steve: Thanks for the follow-up on Mont Alto. It looks like Prusse was probably the engineer superintendent of construction on both the Deutschland and the Bremen. His official designation i

  1. #761


    I would tend to be in agreement with your comment Dwight, in that, if the tally was produced as a popular item of the times it may well have served to boost a souvenir or benefit market.

    Let's hope someone will see this thread and surprise us all in some way or another.

    It is wise to remember that collectively we have, in earnest, been re-identifying artifacts, vessel details and images, since you originally started this thread - a thread for which we all give you our hearty huzzahs!

  2. #762


    STBaltimore: You're right that the tally could have been produced in 1916 for other than "official" purposes, such as fund-raising. I'm not srtong on that because it lacks any indication of what the charitible donation (that the purchase price might have represented) was. For example, for the benefit of the POWs in Siberia, etc. It could have been made in Germany for wartime sales as a patriotic sort of gimmic or a kid's toy item. If they were produced during 1916 for any of those purposes, they would rate a spot in any collection, simply because the would be an "associated" item. Yes, those things are possible, but I would still put my money on it being a fantasy item aimed at the Deutschland artifact collectors crowd, the sort of thing that Charlie Snyder would cook up and sell on Ebay. That puts it in the same category as the 2-inch x 3.25-inch, flat "tablet" that has been produced in lead and pewter for the same purpose. If new Handels-U-Boot-Deutschland tallies were produced for sale during the upcoming 2016 event in Baltimore, they would probably find a ready market there, and we would shortly thereafter start seeing them on Ebay as "genuine." But those that were known to have been produced specifically for the Centenial event, would allso rate a spot in a Deutschland artifacts collection as being "associated." Just like the reproduction DOR hat badges, if any are ever made. Dwight

  3. #763


    Quote by gilhoolie View Post
    Here’s an advertisement from a November, 1916 issue of The Fatherland magazine selling a U-Deutschland game.

    Attachment 574984
    gilhoolie: Welcome to the Forum. Awesome post! Thanks for sharing this with us.
    Have any of you guys seen this game before? This would be great to own!
    Thanks again, gilhoolie!


  4. #764


    OK, I have finally gotten the information I needed regarding the "tablets" or paperweights that have been so heavily counterfeited. In an earlier post I asked anyone who had a genuine iron example to post it. Instead of posting their examples, both of these people contacted me by email. These photos together with several sources made it possible to put it all together so that those of us who collect these things can readily recognize the genuine item from the fakes. Both designs are legitimate but the legitimacy of the article rests on whether or not the article is made of iron. If it isn't iron, it isn't genuine. And no matter what metal is used, if it's cast it's a fake. The photos below are genuine artifacts.
    Click image for larger version. 

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    Example designed for the American Committee for the Relief of Widows and Orphans of the War in Germany and die-stamped by Interboro Medal & Badge Company, NY

    Click image for larger version. 

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    Note the sharpness of the detail and the square (unrounded) edge.

    Click image for larger version. 

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    Example designed for the Prisoners of War Relief Committee and
    struck by Interboro Medal & Badge Co., NY
    Dave Schenkman collection

    Click image for larger version. 

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    Reverse side of the same example
    Dave Schenkman collection

    When the U-Deutschland was in Baltimore in July 1916, several tons of her ballast were given to two wartime charitable groups to use for fund-raising. The two organizations were the Prisoners of War Relief Committee and the American Relief Committee for Widows and Orphans of the War in Germany. Both groups commissioned Hans Schuler, a Baltimore sculptor, to design souvenirs that would be sold along the Eastern Seaboard to raise money for the groups’ causes. The two charity groups sent the Schuler designs and the cast iron ballast to Interboro Medal and Badge Company in New York to make the souvenirs, which were die struck. Schuler had created two very similar designs for these paperweights which are 2-inches by 3.25 inches and have nearly identical wording. The version with the sun and U-boat was made for the Prisoners of War Relief Committee, and other version with the oncoming U-boat was created for the American Committee for Relief of Widows and Orphans of the War in Germany. Both had headquarters in New York, and both were registered with the United States Department of State. Both versions have sharp detail and square (un-rounded) edges. Any examples of these paperweights that are purportedly genuine but are made of any metal other than iron, are fakes. Dwight

    Sources: Records of the Department of State, RG59, M367, Roll 179, File 763.72111/2670, "Prisoners of War Relief Committee Statement of the First Year Ending October 1916," ; Dave Schenkman, "A Relic Medal of the German Submarine Deutschland," published in Numismatist, American Numistic Society, and reproduced online in E-Sylum, Numismatic Bibliomania Society, vol. 15, No. 26, 24 June 2012, Article 14.; Jörg Nimmergut, "Ein Erinnerungskreuz besonderer Art," Orden-Miltar-Magazine 1990; and Reinhard Bense, "Paul Lebrecht König--Kapitän des Handels-U-Bootes U-Deutschland," Militaria, 1/2011, pp. 4-14.

  5. #765

    Question Cutaway Illustration of the U-DEUTSCHLAND

    I don't know how many here may have seen the U-DEUTSCHLAND cutaway illustration below but here goes... up periscope.

  6. #766



    I not dead yet!! Work has been consuming all my time. I even missed the memorial with St. Baltimore, which broke my heart, because of work. I really need to spend more time on this site with you folks.

    I want a copy of that board game. Nice find!!

    Good detective work on the fake artifacts. Then again you were/are a detective. I hope the book is going well for you. I do have one very important piece of information for you; under no circumstances lock down the chapter on U-Deutschland artifacts. It would seem that I scored the granddaddy of all U-Deutschland artifacts! It will be delivered to my house on October 11th. I will be working from home that day to be on hand to unload the artifact from the truck. There were so many things lost in WW II, how this thing managed to survive and make it to the States is a miracle.

    Needless to say, I will fill you in on all the details (and lots of pictures) as soon as I get a hold of it next weekend.

    Until then, don’t sink to deep.

    Steve Zuke

  7. #767


    Not even a little hint, Steve?


  8. #768



    It will knock your socks off!!

    My minions had to steal a time machine to get it (the Dr. is still looking for his TARDIS).

    It will make Claas say bad words in German.

    Next to finding the U-Bremen, I think this is the best you could get.

    I will Post something next Friday the 11th before 10:00 PM eastern time.

    That’s it for hints.

    St. Baltimore you keep your mouth shut! No good Hints! (He was a great help in tracking it down Luke, and has been involved from the word go. Thank you again)

    Best of luck at guessing,

    Steve Zuke

    P.S Well maybe one hint, it takes to grown men to lift it.

  9. #769


    Steve: OK, I will wait impatiently until 11 October. The Naval Institute Press has taken the manuscript under consideration and I hope to hear somethng in a week or two. At this point I am optimistic. Dwight

  10. #770


    You know the drill, once I own it I can give you permission to use it in your book. I could not say anything before all the details were hammered out. Negotiations were hot and heavy, and took a while.


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