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Ersatz and Butcher bayonet marks help please.

Article about: Hi guys back to bug ye. I am new to bayonets. Picked these up this week and I am very happy with their condition and the fact I got them local. I am interested to know the following if you d

  1. #1

    Default Ersatz and Butcher bayonet marks help please.

    Hi guys back to bug ye. I am new to bayonets.
    Picked these up this week and I am very happy with their condition and the fact I got them local.
    I am interested to know the following if you donít mind please.
    Does anyone know what the bottom two marks represent on the spine of the 98/05 1915 made butchers bayonet.
    The Ersatz looks similar to the EB23 on BAyonet Collection Presentation site but not quite the same. It may be just another variation. There is only two stamps on it, an inspection stamp on the spine, and a hexagon of dots on the cross guard area which I have seen somewhere before on this forum, any ideas what these dots represent.
    Is it normal to have a ball on the bottom of a FAG scabbard.
    Sorry for the flash its been raining here all day.
    As always thanks in advance
    Rod
    Click image for larger version. 

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  2. #2

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    Hi. i'm sorry I cannot help you but I love the imperial marks on the bayonet!! A very nice item. Leon.
    "Always do sober what you said you'd do drunk. That will teach you to keep your mouth shut." Ernest Hemingway

  3. #3

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    Quote by FALLSCHIRMJAGER View Post
    Hi. i'm sorry I cannot help you but I love the imperial marks on the bayonet!! A very nice item. Leon.
    Thank you Leon.
    The butchers has inspection marks on just about every part. The blades look like they have never been sharpened.
    As i say i only have four bayonets now, so i canít call myself a collector of these yet.
    Thanks
    Rod

  4. #4
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    Plumbob, the "Crown over RC" marking is applied to a specific part of a weapon (rifles, bayonets, etc.) that is out of spec but still useable if circumstances require it. It means "Revision Commission" and it shows that the part is close enough and over-rides the inspector who pointed out the problem absolving him of blame if called into question.

    The "hexagon of dots" on your very nice (and scarce) ersatz bayonet appears to be nothing more than a mark from being clamped in the serrated jaws of a vice, nothing more. Doesn't hurt the value of the bayonet and, in fact, it may have come from the manufacturer with those marks.

  5. #5

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    Thank you USNV5 for taking the time to reply.
    That is very interesting information about the RC stamp, I donít think i would have ever found that out on my own. I also now think you completely correct about the vice marks I never gave that a thought , this may explain the other marks either side of the grip beside the button.
    Do you happen to know if this Ersatz has a collectors model number (code).
    Iíve still to find another FAG scabbard with a ball on the bottom.
    Here is a picture of the makers mark on the butchers, and the back of frog that came with Ersatz for future reference.
    Regards
    Rod
    Click image for larger version. 

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  6. #6
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    Glad to be of assistance, Rod. The Ersatz bayonet may be an EB-29, so called due to Anthony Carter's listing in his 4 volume work, German Bayonets. Carter leads us in studying the ersatz bayonets in Volume III of this detailed work. There are at least 9 similar bayonets with this style cast hilt - some with brass hilts and most, like yours, with steel hilts - and EB29 is the closest to yours with the sharp pommel beak and plain, unfullered blade but the muzzle ring on yours is set back slightly from the rest of the hilt. That last detail is slightly different from the one Carter illustrates as EB29 but otherwise it is the closest I can come to saying exactly. We have to remember that the ersatz bayonets were made by many different small shops and the producer, not working to an exact and rigid pattern, could have small variations in his run.

    Your FAG scabbard still retains it's ball tip which was put on by compression. Most have lost this over time, it's attachment was not very strong and being subject to blows in wear, it could easily loosen and fall off.

    That is also a nice frog, sized to fit the scabbard for the Sg98/05 so it fits perfectly on the FAG scabbard which is slightly wider that the other Ersatz scabbards.

  7. #7

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    Thanks again for your help USNV5.
    The only examples I could find on the net were that on the old smithy site, where they havenít got a EB29 shown. But now that you have pointed me in the right direction, I found one for comparison and I agree they look very similar so that will do for me thanks.
    All the scabbards had balls on them, thanks. it is very flimsy , I can understand why they would break off.
    You have been very helpful USNV5
    Thank you
    Rod

  8. #8
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    Not a problem, I love the ersatz bayonets, you can never have too many.

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