Become our sponsor and display your banner here
Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast
Results 1 to 10 of 13

Fake Fencing/Jukenjutsu Proficiency Badge

Article about: This looks fake to me ... signs of casting PLUS .... no kanji on the back. Were these badges ever made without the "NCO," "1st Class", or "2nd Class" designatio

  1. #1

    Default Fake Fencing/Jukenjutsu Proficiency Badge

    This looks fake to me ... signs of casting PLUS .... no kanji on the back.
    Were these badges ever made without the "NCO," "1st Class", or "2nd Class" designations on the reverse?

    --Guy
    Attached Images Attached Images Fake Fencing/Jukenjutsu Proficiency Badge Fake Fencing/Jukenjutsu Proficiency Badge Fake Fencing/Jukenjutsu Proficiency Badge 

  2. #2
    ?

    Default

    Many proficiency badges aren't marked on the back. Dai Nippon Military Antiques Army Proficiency Badge 1

  3. #3

    Default

    Quote by Ryoyo View Post
    Many proficiency badges aren't marked on the back. Dai Nippon Military Antiques Army Proficiency Badge 1
    Thanks, was unaware of that fact.

    --Guy

  4. #4
    ?

    Default

    that can be late war ??

  5. #5
    ?

    Default

    that can be late war ??

    From old discution of Nick Komiya

    It does not look like a copy to me, but I only quoted the 1934 Jukenjutsu badge regulations (that was when they were first established) to you before, like a snapshot, and never studied how they evolved thereafter, so I cannot tell you more about this badge. The 1934 version badges had the badge names in relief on the back like the pre-1912 marksmanship badges, so yours would be a later version, because of the blank back.

    You have to track the post 1934 evolution of all the Kenjutsu manuals in the archives I guided you to, and look up the badge regulations in each. I wrote the marksmanship badge story to show you how it's done, because I myself have no interest nor stamina to do an evolution study on all army proficiency badges. But the Jukenjutsu badge only had a short history compared to the marksmanship badge, so it should not be overwhelmingly difficult to research, provided you learn some Japanese.

  6. #6

    Default

    JapanX (the other Nick) says this is a good badge, circa 1940.

    Thanks everyone!

    --Guy

  7. #7
    ?

    Default

    You have more info for dating this, when start the productioin without kanji in the behind badge?

  8. #8

    Default

    Quote by Type4 View Post
    You have more info for dating this, when start the productioin without kanji in the behind badge?
    Sorry, but I do not have any more information. JapanX says "circa 1940" -- he's a highly knowledgeable collector.

  9. #9

    Default

    Guy, I did some checking for you while taking a break from my back breaking effort to properly stow away my German militaria that I finally brought over to Germany from Canada, where I had them for the past 20 years.

    So your question was "from when did they remove the badge class designations from the rear of the Kenjutsu Proficiency Badges"?

    As of 1939 June 15th, when the last update to the Kenjutsu Manual went into print, the badge still consisted of 3 grades, ie a NCO-grade badge and a Class 1 and Class 2 badges, all of which were to be marked accordingly on the back of the badge.

    Then on 1940 November 27th, an Emperor's command (軍令陸第35号) was issued, allowing the Minister of the Army (Tojo) leeway to establish Rinji (temporary) specs for the material and designs of army proficiency badges in general.

    Based on the above permission from the Emperor, Army Ordinance 88 was issued 2 days later, on 29th November 1940, which decreed that henceforth there would only be aluminum badges in gold for NCO and silver Almite finish for EM. Thus, at this point in time, distinctions of class 1 and class 2 disappeared and as the NCO badge was differentiated by its gold coloring, designations naming the class of the badge got omitted from this point.

    Accordingly, on 18th December 1940 orders were issued to ship out these new spec badges to the troops in the field. For instance, the Kwantung Army was to receive at its Dailan depot, 130 pcs of the gold NCO Kenjutsu badges and 2,610 pcs of the silver EM badges. So as a rule of thumb, the gold ones are roughly 20 times rarer than the silver aluminum ones. These were supplied in early 1941.

    So for these badges, plain backs are only associated with aluminum badges and were produced from the last month of 1940 and issued from early 1941. I suppose the badge you show is in aluminum and in gold color. If not in aluminum it is fake, because of the lack of writing on the back.

    However, as noted, these Rinji specs adopted in 1940 were only temporary and specs were to return to the earlier setup as soon as the material supply situation allowed.

  10. #10

    Default

    So Guy it sounds like, from hat Nick is saying, if this is aluminum and has what clearly looks like a gold finish - then it's a pretty nice find! Can't really see details enough to say it's die cast or not.

Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast

Similar Threads

  1. HJ proficiency badge silver

    In Hitler Jugend forum
    12-28-2017, 12:58 PM
  2. DJ proficiency Badge

    In Hitler Jugend forum
    06-18-2015, 03:23 PM
  3. HJ Proficiency Badge in Silver

    In Hitler Jugend forum
    10-27-2011, 08:05 PM

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •