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E.Pack & Sohn 1938 K98 bayonet with frog / information requested

Article about: Beautiful frog, dating from med. period. For your bayonet, is correct one, without hilt strap. (With aluminum rivets.) Just need to take off Portepee. (They was never used the K98 combat bay

  1. #1
    PzB
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    Post E.Pack & Sohn 1938 K98 bayonet with frog / information requested

    This was the first piece I "collected" when I was around 12 years old (26 years ago).
    Got it from a second hand store in Norway for ~45$ back in the 80s.

    So it rested in a closet for years and just recently did I take it out for a more thorough examination.
    The blade is gleaming black with some slight sharpening at the tip (always smelled of weapons oil.).
    The hardwood handle is dull brown and one of the screws on the handle seems to be stuck with some scratches on it.

    Maker: E.Pack&S (the top edge of the blade is marked with "40" - so I assume this is a 1940 vintage bayonet -atcually it looks like it says +0 ..wondered about this).
    Number: 6866 d

    The scabbard comes with a leather frog (no maker visible) and is of a different maker than the bayonet.
    Missing a screw on the top side and has an eagle on the ball.
    Maker: Rich. A. Herder 1938
    Number: 4027

    Click image for larger version. 

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    Not really great pictures I got, need a better camera. Will replace picture with better ones soon!
    Also need a magnifying glas to see the tiny numbers on the top of the hilt beneath the eagles (2 eagles on top with another on the release button.

    Still, as a newbie here I would appreciate if anyone could help provide any information about this bayonet.

    1. Were bayonets ever coupled with scabbards of different makers or is this done by collectors / sellers later on?
    2. What is rarity of this example on a scale from 1-10?

    Anything else you can add from the information provided?

    Thx!

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  3. #2

    Default re: E.Pack & Sohn 1938 K98 bayonet with frog / information requested

    Hi, bayonets and scabbards have got mixed up over the years, some in wartime service I am sure, while others have got mixed up in postwar service with other armies and then finally collectors/dealers come into the mix. All you can say is it did not start life like this.

    The frog is not German issue.

    Pack made bayonets are fairly common.

    Cheers, Ade.
    Had good advice? Saved money? Why not become a Gold Club Member, just hit the green "Join WRF Club" tab at the top of the page and help support the forum!

  4. #3
    PzB
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    Default re: E.Pack & Sohn 1938 K98 bayonet with frog / information requested

    Again I have to assume, but much German weaponry was used by the Post WWII Norwegian Army.
    Later on the Home Guard "inherited" it. So it's possible that the frog is a local variant.

    Remember my father told me that he operated a German mortar in the early 50s when he did his service in the army.
    Told about how helmets and general German equipment lay littered around former position up north in Finmark.

  5. #4

    Default re: E.Pack & Sohn 1938 K98 bayonet with frog / information requested

    Indeed, the Norwegian Army had a lot of former German kit.

    Cheers, Ade.
    Had good advice? Saved money? Why not become a Gold Club Member, just hit the green "Join WRF Club" tab at the top of the page and help support the forum!

  6. #5

    Default Re: E.Pack & Sohn 1938 K98 bayonet with frog / information requested

    Well Pzb.....your addiction to collecting has begun,,,and at the top of this forum is a thread that specializes in code markings and distributuors....heres the link:..http://www.warrelics.eu/forum/dagger...-codes-233978/. ...This will help you with your identity on what is numbered on your scabbard and bayonet.
    There is a great team of other K98 collectors that will be willing to help out also with any questions you may have.
    You have came to the right place to find the answers you need. Regards Larry
    It is not the size of a Collection in History that matters......Its the size of your Passion for it!! - Larry C

    One never knows what tree roots push to the surface of what laid buried before the tree was planted - Larry C

    “The farther back you can look, the farther forward you are likely to see.” - Winston Churchill

  7. #6
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    Default Re: E.Pack & Sohn 1938 K98 bayonet with frog / information requested

    Pzb,
    The frog is Belgian. It wasn't unusual for the Germans to re-use captured materiel.

    Len

  8. #7
    PzB
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    Default Re: E.Pack & Sohn 1938 K98 bayonet with frog / information requested

    That's most interesting Len!
    - I immediately got a request from someone that collects Belgium frogs.
    I'm apt to consider a swap for a German frog since it isn't that important for me.

  9. #8
    PzB
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    Default Re: E.Pack & Sohn 1938 K98 bayonet with frog / information requested

    You are indeed right Larry, impressed by the help and knowledge to be found on this forum!!
    Here is the history I was told about the Belgium frog that came with my old bayonet:

    "In the time between 1940 - 1945 and after 1945 the Norwegian Security Police use Norwegian Bayonets 1894 together with this frog.
    Most of the bayonets were shorted and phosphates former Norwegian M1916.
    These frogs were imported from Belgium since 1940. The color were always brown.
    The frogs were an export product from an unknown Belgian maker to Norway."

    Fascinating; imagine how bayonet, scabbard and frog have different stories and one day came together.

  10. #9

    Default Re: E.Pack & Sohn 1938 K98 bayonet with frog / information requested

    True, though the Germans during WW2 trying to use seized bayonets - along with original bayonet (Belgian) frog. In most cases.
    (Bayonet Belgian - Belgian Frog)
    My thinking, the bayonet and frog, joined after the war.
    But we can not know with 100% certainty.

    regards
    Vedran

  11. #10
    PzB
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    Default Re: E.Pack & Sohn 1938 K98 bayonet with frog / information requested

    Received an original frog and portepee in exchange for the old Belgian frog.
    So the bayonet is back to a more original form!

    Click image for larger version. 

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