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A WWII sawbacked Bayonet, a reworked WWI Sawbacked Bayonet, or a fantasy piece?

Article about: Greetings all, I took a chance on purchasing an “oddball” bayonet I saw for sale today; it is an ASW marked matching set (Both Blade & Scabbard have 3706j stamped upon them along with 42

  1. #1

    Default A WWII sawbacked Bayonet, a reworked WWI Sawbacked Bayonet, or a fantasy piece?

    Greetings all,

    I took a chance on purchasing an “oddball” bayonet I saw for sale today; it is an ASW marked matching set (Both Blade & Scabbard have 3706j stamped upon them along with 42 ASW). While I’m aware ASW is the code for E & F Hoerster Solingen, my question is, is this bayonet just a reworked/re-arsenal-ed WWI sawbacked bayonet or something else? Bottom line, I did not know there were sawbacked combat blade variants made during WWII or is this some “fantasy piece.” Yes, I am aware of the dress bayonet variants for the pioneers and even fire department, but unaware of combat blade variants with sawbacks. Your thoughts are most welcomed.

    Pictures are not mine, but when it arrives I will upload close-ups of the aforementioned markings.

    V/r Lance

    Click image for larger version. 

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  3. #2
    MAP
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    I thought sawback bayo's were outlawed after WW1? But could just be an old tale I was told that is not true.
    "Please", Thank You" and proper manners appreciated

    My greatest fear is that one day I will die and my wife will sell my guns for what I told her I paid for them

    "Don't tell me these are investments if you never intend to sell anything" (Quote: Wife)

  4. #3

    Default

    Interesting... The 42 ASW stamping on the bayonet doesn't look very good, although I've seen weak stampings on the ASW blades before (because of finish grinding, but I don't see grind marks here, I see earlier fine finish?), but I'never seen or heard of a sawback variation, the sawback itself having been outlawed during WWI.

  5. #4

    Default

    Agreed, the 42ASW stamping on the blade is quite weak, but as mentioned I have seen this flaw on other ASW marked blades (42 dated ones at that). The blade's poorly stamped smaller fonts match well with other ASW stamped examples on the WWW. Agreed too, about the lack of ever seeing or hearing of another WWII manufactured sawback except for the aforementioned extra seitengewehr (dress) variants. Thank you (all) for your observations.

    V/r Lance

  6. #5

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    Hi I think you are correct in the idea that this is a ww1 bayonet. True that sawbacks were outlawed, but so were many other thing the Germans decided to ignore. I belive ww1, re worked, or re stamped, and re issued.

  7. #6

    Default

    Would definitely be a one off if that's the case. I'm sure we've all heard the stories of "what would happen to a German soldier if they were found with a "butcher" bayonet", so they ground the sawbacks down, but it's possible that were never issued and a little over 20 years later reissued? But this bayonet construction is pure WWII and doesn't look like a converted WWI "butcher" blade. There was that bayonet collector in France, with literally hundreds... his expertise would be useful here.

    Example;

    eBay - WW I Butchers Bayonet ??? - Wehrmacht-Awards.com Militaria Forums

  8. #7
    MAP
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    Quote by KEVIN23 View Post
    ......True that sawbacks were outlawed, but so were many other thing the Germans decided to ignore....
    I believe a German soldier captured with one of these in his possession have been shot on the spot. I find it doubtful that this is WW2 period. But just my view and happy to be proven wrong.
    "Please", Thank You" and proper manners appreciated

    My greatest fear is that one day I will die and my wife will sell my guns for what I told her I paid for them

    "Don't tell me these are investments if you never intend to sell anything" (Quote: Wife)

  9. #8

    Default

    I'm very sorry to have to say this, but well over 10 years ago there were a number of bayonets that were converted to saw backs including some usually lesser quality WW II German combat bayonets. Once they were exposed as fakes and no one would buy one it seemed to have stopped, and I haven't seen any for some time now. But they did not evaporate, so I imagine that here and there one will turn up as collections are broken up or sold. Best Regards, Fred

  10. #9

    Default

    Hello,

    the answer is very easy...

    This is a Seitengewehr 84/98 with a later (after 1945) added sawback.... to maximize the selling price.

    A few were destroyed in this way. For any serious collector this bayontes are out of the question.

    This bayonets are not total fakes. There are bastardised - and in this way destroyed - originals.

    Bummer!

  11. #10

    Default

    Quote by Sleepwalker View Post
    Hello,

    the answer is very easy...

    This is a Seitengewehr 84/98 with a later (after 1945) added sawback.... to maximize the selling price.

    A few were destroyed in this way. For any serious collector this bayontes are out of the question.

    This bayonets are not total fakes. There are bastardised - and in this way destroyed - originals.

    Bummer!

    Win some lose some, thank you very much for this post. Any chance of links or guidance to photos some of these bastardized versions?

    Thank you, again.

    V/r Lance

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