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Navy Pommels (Picture Proof)

Article about: Lately I have been trying to get a point across about WKC having something to do with the design and manufacture of some navy pommels used by some of the companies who produced navy daggers.

  1. #21
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    [QUOTE=Sorge;1613435]And again if we take a WKC type triangular chest and Horster (+/

    Being able to do this shows that they are all basically the same pommel, you could not switch around like this on an Alcoso, Holler or Eickhorn and create another companies pommel.
    Best Tomaz.

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  3. #22
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    [QUOTE=Tomaz;1613477]
    Quote by Sorge View Post
    And again if we take a WKC type triangular chest and Horster (+/

    Being able to do this shows that they are all basically the same pommel, you could not switch around like this on an Alcoso, Holler or Eickhorn and create another companies pommel.
    Best Tomaz.
    I understand your point of view Tomaz, but also we have enough differences that we can consider that each company was producing its own parts. As I mentioned earlier, without period company documents it will be very difficult to clearly determine.

    Sorge

  4. #23
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    Quote by dr73 View Post
    That's an impressive collection of navy daggers you are showing Sorge! I hope you will share some pictures of the complete daggers with us in the near future.

    Danny
    Thanks Danny,
    If you want to see concrete daggers, just let me know.
    It will be nice to know your opinion.

    Sorge

  5. #24

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    Very interesting article! Here is my contribution. This one on an E F Horster. Thanks, Bob

    Click image for larger version. 

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  6. #25
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    This is one of the most beautiful pommels, Bob! Congrats
    Replacement Eickhorn type, therefore your dagger should be M29 Horster with early stamped TM.

    Sorge

  7. #26
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    [QUOTE=Sorge;1613695]
    Quote by Tomaz View Post
    I understand your point of view Tomaz, but also we have enough differences that we can consider that each company was producing its own parts. As I mentioned earlier, without period company documents it will be very difficult to clearly determine.

    Sorge
    Without documentation I agree that it is very difficult to work out who made what, that's why we have to go on what we can observe and much information is gathered through observations and comparisons. Imagine if two totally different car companies released their new model and they both had the exact same body design, there would be a major court case to find out who stole who's design, only with some kind of collaboration between the companies would this be allowed.
    Thanks Bob for showing the Eickhorn replacement pommel, for those who don't know if you look at the wreath it is the same design as their standard one but placed slightly lower down to the pedestal.

    Best Tomaz.

  8. #27

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    Speaking as a general matter there was a system in place to protect intellectual property like proprietary designs. As seen with some period swords and other items that have a Ges. Gesch. (Gesetzlich Geschützt) marking that was a part of the Musterschutz system of legal protections. Not always a Ges. Gesch. there were variations, which in any case had to be registered (published) which was effective for 5 years, and could be extended for two more 5 year periods. With the question from my own perspective being what rises to the level of being a design unique enough to be granted legal protection? And if that is the case shouldn't the protected item be marked to warn others to not copy it which is not uncommon with various and sundry other TR period artifacts? Best Regards, Fred

  9. #28
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    [QUOTE=Sorge;1613695]
    Quote by Tomaz View Post
    I understand your point of view Tomaz, but also we have enough differences that we can consider that each company was producing its own parts. As I mentioned earlier, without period company documents it will be very difficult to clearly determine.

    Sorge
    Hi Sorge,

    I would really like to see more of your Klaas, Puma and Alcoso navy. Looking forward to it.

    Danny

  10. #29

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    Quote by Sorge View Post
    This is one of the most beautiful pommels, Bob! Congrats
    Replacement Eickhorn type, therefore your dagger should be M29 Horster with early stamped TM.

    Sorge
    Thank you and yes, you are correct about the Trade Mark. Bob

  11. #30
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    Quote by Frogprince View Post
    With the question from my own perspective being what rises to the level of being a design unique enough to be granted legal protection? And if that is the case shouldn't the protected item be marked to warn others to not copy it which is not uncommon with various and sundry other TR period artifacts? Best Regards, Fred
    I would expect a company as large as WKC to have some sort of protection in place for their designs and only with their permission would another company be able to adopt the design for their product. With an intricate part of the WKCs pommel design like the leaf wreath being seen on other companies pommels the only way this could have happened would be with WKCs permission, if these other companies were making their own parts why would they want to use someone else's design. If your making something from scratch then you would have your own complete unique design.

    Because there are differences on the other pommels (head and swastika) does not mean another company had to have made it, it is the exact same features seen that link the pommel, or any item for that matter, that allows you to attribute the item to a particular company. If you look at army cross guards you can see the slight changes the same company has made to create a new type, otherwise it would mean every company only produced one guard which we know was not the case.

    Best Tomaz.

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