Fliegerschützenabzeichen badges : real or fakes?

[uhugreg]

Hi guys,

I am currently looking for a gunner badge for my grandpa, who used to be on a Ju 88 at the i/NJG.5
Problem is, my budget is quite limited (less than 400€), and I have absolutely no clue what is the real deal or not.
I was adviced several dealers : point is not to damage anyone's reputation, but to get your feedbacks if you think the items I show you might be genuine, or not
Dealer 1 (cheapest)

Dealer 2 (not cheap, but is doint heavy discounts, which makes me carreful)

Dealer 3

Thanks in advance for your help, I hope I am not abusive with three different requests in the same thread.

[big ned]

Both JMME badges look legitimate zinc/nickel silver hybrid ROAG examples to me, although the first one has a repaired hinge/pin and has lost all it's finish on the zinc wreath. The second one is much nicer unmessed with badge in my opinion, and worth more because of this. I believe the third badge is a fake. Better wait out for other replies on this though as I'm not as hot on these as I would like.

Regards, Ned.

[uhugreg]

Thanks a lot for you feedback ned, I really appreciate this

[Kradmelder]

I agree with Ned.

The first badge have also a new/repaired catch based on this pics. The second IMME badge is looking nice, with the correct catch also. The third badge it`s imo also a fake.

KR
Joe

[Landsknecht]

If you want a mint untouched Assmann, I have one for sale...
in the classifieds section.
Reduced !!! Cased ground assault badge!!! - Militaria Collectibles buy - sell at War Relics

[Saladin]

The third one is really unusual.
I have not seen a copy like this one before.
Look at the swastika it looks to be cut out all the way round...This is a first for me . I wish I could see an unedited picture of this one.

Looking at the hardware on the back, there are similar examples used on FLL ROAG badges but the eagle looks to be more like a post war Souval or even a wartime Karneth (RK)

Anyway back to original post...I would go for the second one...No controversy there it seems. It looks like the last of the line that was produced by Jmme and Sohn with the zinc wreath and buntmetal eagle

All the best
Doug

[big ned]

The third one is really unusual.
I have not seen a copy like this one before.
Look at the swastika it looks to be cut out all the way round...This is a first for me . I wish I could see an unedited picture of this one.

Looking at the hardware on the back, there are similar examples used on FLL ROAG badges but the eagle looks to be more like a post war Souval or even a wartime Karneth (RK)

Anyway back to original post...I would go for the second one...No controversy there it seems. It looks like the last of the line that was produced by Jmme and Sohn with the zinc wreath and buntmetal eagle

All the best
Doug

Hi Doug,

I was doing a bit more researching and found that it's a reasonably common fake design that comes with a variety of different hardware set ups including the Souval "claw foot" catch and the design itself is a close copy of the original Souval post war ROAG badge that started appearing in the 60's and 70's.

Here's the obverse side of another the same barring the cut out swastika.



Regards, Ned.

[Saladin]

Thanks for that input Ned,
I had to just do some more research myself before answering originally as it had me stumped especially with the FLL attributed hardware..... and Linden's finishing leaves a lot to be desired sometimes.
I spotted the claw fake and even though there are minute differences (more than likely down to the casting process) there has been a lot of finishing work done to the third badge.
The swastika is cut out. If you look closely, it looks as though the Swastika has been cut out and then the hook applied over the cut edges?!
Note that the outer edge of the wreath...particularly on the 'oak side' has a lot more detail than the one you posted.
I really would like to have a look at that one in hand to see what work has been done on it to give it that more genuine feel.

All the best
Doug

[Kradmelder]

Hi Doug,

I was doing a bit more researching and found that it's a reasonably common fake design that comes with a variety of different hardware set ups including the Souval "claw foot" catch and the design itself is a close copy of the original Souval post war ROAG badge that started appearing in the 60's and 70's.

Here's the obverse side of another the same barring the cut out swastika.



Regards, Ned.

I think a similar badge is listed in the WAF database as a so called flatback/greyback. Not a type i would like to own...it´s also listed as a questionable piece.

[FALLSCHIRMJAGER]

Hi, personally I like award 1 the best as I like pieces that have "been there and battered" a bit, but the more desirable one for most will be badge 2. Leon.