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Kriegsabzeichen für Minensuch-, U-Boots-Jagd- und Sicherungsverbände maker

Article about: Hello all, I ran across this badge on the web can wanted to know the maker. Anyone know where to find this one again or knows who owns it? William Kramer

  1. #1

    Default Kriegsabzeichen für Minensuch-, U-Boots-Jagd- und Sicherungsverbände maker

    Hello all,

    I ran across this badge on the web can wanted to know the maker. Anyone know where to find this one again or knows who owns it?

    William Kramer
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  3. #2

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    Looks like an R.K. buntmetall example to me Will. Other than that I can't help I'm afraid.

    Regards, Ned
    'I do not think we can hope for any better thing now.
    We shall stick it out to the end, but we are getting weaker of course, and the end cannot be far.
    It seems a pity, but I do not think I can write more. R. SCOTT.
    Last Entry - For God's sake look after our people.'

    In memory of Capt. Robert Falcon Scott, Edward Wilson, Henry Bowers, Lawrence Oates and Edgar Evans. South Pole Expedition, 30th March 1912.

  4. #3

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    Any reverse shot's ??

    As mentioned,possibly a tombak R.K ?

    Regards,Martin.

  5. #4
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    Hi William,

    Not an R.K. but very close. It's the Gablonz-made unmarked Tombak Minesweeper, possibly attributed to Adolf Sholze or "A.S in triangle"., MC# 3.2.1 in the Minesweeper classification system.
    You posted the same type not long ago on WAF: maker of this Minesweeper badge - Wehrmacht-Awards.com Militaria Forums

    Best regards,
    ---Norm
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  6. #5

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    Hi William, looks like Norm has given you the answer needed, all I would add is that it is a fine looking piece and as long as the reverse hardware is complete, it is a beauty for anyone's collection. Leon.
    "Always do sober what you said you'd do drunk. That will teach you to keep your mouth shut." Ernest Hemingway

  7. #6

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    well I am actually looking to purchase it but I can't remember where I saw it posted. Amazing the variance in coloration between identical makers.

    Let me explain the particulars of what I'm after. I am hoping to find a very "bronze/copper" colored badge that is similar to these examples that I am posting below, which tend to stray from the more gold/brass color in seen in most badges.

    The only one I can find for sale that would match this somewhat is on e-medals:

    A Kriegsmarine Minesweeper War Badge by Rudolf Karneth & Söhne - Minesweeper Badge - Kriegsmarine Badges - Third Reich - Kriegsmarine - Germany - Europe

    I feel the badge I first posted is the best match, however I can't track it down and don't remember where I ran across it on the web.

    If anyone has a better candidate in tombak that they'd sell me (or knows where one is for sale) please PM me, thank you!

    William Kramer
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  8. #7
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    Hi William,

    I don't quite understand. Are you saying that you're looking in general for worn badges that have lost all their gilding/finish to show the raw Tombak with the acquired patina of age to look dark?

    Because I think for the most part all the Minesweepers shown (including the RK from e-medals) are made of the same base metal but show differences in residual gilding, patina and flash photography. The "unmarked AS" badge that you showed in the opening post would originally have borne a gilding which is unique among Minesweepers with a slightly olive tone to it (like the one I posted), but that example has lost virtually all of its gilding aside some tiny amounts in the crevices and thus exhibits the colour of Tombak with the patina of age. The unworn one I showed was photographed in halogen lighting with a flash and so looks quite brilliant (and looks not nearly so stunning when viewed in natural light).

    Here's another example, intermediate in wear between the one I posted and the one you posted. This nicely illustrates the difference between the residual gilding with that slightly olive tone (typical of this maker) and the underlying Tombak base metal.

    Best regards,
    ---Norm
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  9. #8
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    Here's the RK Minesweeper from e-medals for which you posted the link. This likewise nicely shows the difference between the residual gilding and the underlying Tombak with patina. The gilding on the RK is more golden than the olive tone of the "unmarked AS". The silvered fountain and reverse of the RK Minesweeper often oxidize to that black colour you see here -- something which is reversed by many dealers by chemical dipping.

    Best regards,
    ---Norm
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  10. #9
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    In contrast, here are a couple of unworn RK Minesweepers with intact gilding, variations #3.1.2 and #3.1.3. The silvered reverse shows some of the dark oxidation but it's tempered by the intact white frosting over top.

    Best regards,
    ---Norm
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  11. #10

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    basically I'm just looking for a badge with the same coloration as the others I've posted, whether the finish is gone or just with heavy patina.

    For instance, your Schickle fits the bill as does a RK on Geil's site and a few others I've recently come across.

    William Kramer
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