Krimschild Souval?

[Bonecollector]

I think that this is a Souval? Can this be dated to wartime or post war? Thank you

[paulscoot]

Good wartime original imo ,some say Souval some say Rettenmaier. Regards Paul

[Bonecollector]

Many thanks Paul. Is there a way to tell war time Souval from post war Souval? Many thanks for your help.

[Redcap]

There is no evidence that Souval ever made the Krim shield during wartime. This type of shield has also been linked to Orth. If you look at the top right tab there is a slight ripple along the upper edge, something that has been linked to the trimming tools used by Orth.

[Bonecollector]

There is no evidence that Souval ever made the Krim shield during wartime. This type of shield has also been linked to Orth. If you look at the top right tab there is a slight ripple along the upper edge, something that has been linked to the trimming tools used by Orth.

Many thanks. So probably Orth or Rettenmaier. I did read somewhere about the small join between the wing and the eagles head that there was a connection to it being Orth.

[Redcap]

There are two versions of this shield. One with and one without the "joint" between the wing and the eagles head. Presumably the one without the join is the earlier and the join was cause by die damage. Interestingly the one without the join does not have the ripple on the top right tab.

There is a Kuban with the same feature on the tab which has also been suggsted to be from Orth.

[Bonecollector]

There are two versions of this shield. One with and one without the "joint" between the wing and the eagles head. Presumably the one without the join is the earlier and the join was cause by die damage. Interestingly the one without the join does not have the ripple on the top right tab.

There is a Kuban with the same feature on the tab which has also been suggsted to be from Orth.

Many thanks. I'll go with Orth. Glad that it appears to be good.

[Redcap]

Just to illustrate the point here are the two normal Orth types, the one with prongs on the reverse and the rarer late version with tabs.

[Redcap]

Now the reverse. Note the ripple along the top edge of the upper right hand tab. The tabbed shield carries the fo maker mark, very faint but definitely there, so the trimming die used by Orth definitely caused that ripple effect on the upper right tab. So there is at least some circumstantial evidence that these "Souval/Rettenmeier" shields may have come from Orth.

[Redcap]

On the other hand here is the type generally accepted as Rettenmeier. The die characteristics - numerals, coastal outline-especially the eastmost part of the Crimea landmass etc is strikingly similar to the type originally said to be Souval. Don't suppose we will ever know for certain, but we can be sure they are definitely not by Souval.
Once the definitive work on shields is published by Pascal H, hopefully later this year, shield collectors will at last have a top quality reference which should sort out most of the confusion.