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Auction Items good or bad? Pre-War 2nd RP version.

Article about: by A.J. Zawadzki Hi Simon, please share your observations with us. On initial glance there appear to be slight differences in some of the details (snake’s head; feathering on the eagle), but

  1. #201

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    Hi Alexander,

    First off, very nice avatar image you've selected.

    You are exactly right about the improving techniques used by counterfeiters to produce their wares. In the case of this badge one cannot rule out the use of surviving stamping dies either. My feel on it remains favourable as this unit badge is not particularly valuable and I would question whether the expense of making a multi-part fake would be economically worthwhile. Having said that please note that this opinion is by no means the final say on authenticity as I am no authority - merely a student and collector like yourself. And all the more so as any comments I offer to member questions are without benefit of handling the items, which is very important in most cases, and certainly before buying unless a money back guarantee was being offered.

    It's a risky hobby, so remember to question everything and to approach any item with an attitide of "guilty until proven innocent".

    Cheers,
    Tony

    All thoughts and opinions expressed are those of my own and should not be mistaken for medical and/or legal advice.

    "Tomorrow hopes we have learned something from yesterday." - John Wayne

  2. #202
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    Hi, Tony!
    Thank you for your opinion.
    Regarding the avatars - White Eagle in the heart, a Pole
    On the Ukrainian forums and auctions now there are many copies of the Polish badges. Interest in them is now growing. We have to identify a copy at auction and forum («VIOLITY» Auction & Antiques -) - normal collectors do not have to pay for the copies.
    I apologize for the bad English.
    Best regards,
    Alexandr Sinilo

  3. #203

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    Hi guys,

    Sorry for delayed reply to your opinions but recently I was extremely busy. Regarding 4 DS badge, which Alexander is asking about, personally I do not like it. All versions, which I have met were similar to this one attached by Tony. Moreover the nut of the discussed badge is unusual, never seen by me before. It is rather like Russian modern nut combined with Bobkowicz engraving. It is not popular badge and sale of two similar badges made with the same technique in short period of time is very suspicious.

    Regards,
    Jacek

  4. #204

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    Please find below versions of the 4 DS badge, which I have or had:

    VERSION 1 (one part construction):

    Click image for larger version. 

Name:	4 Dyw. Samochodowy - żoł_1.jpg 
Views:	31 
Size:	61.0 KB 
ID:	581298Name:  4 Dyw. Samochodowy - żoł_2.jpg
Views: 213
Size:  197.2 KBClick image for larger version. 

Name:	4 Dyw. Samochodowy - żoł_3.jpg 
Views:	30 
Size:	52.9 KB 
ID:	581300

    VERSION 2 (two parts construction):

    Click image for larger version. 

Name:	4 Dyw. Samochodowy - żoł. -av1.jpg 
Views:	26 
Size:	207.2 KB 
ID:	581305Click image for larger version. 

Name:	4 Dyw. Samochodowy - żoł. -av2.jpg 
Views:	40 
Size:	205.2 KB 
ID:	581306Click image for larger version. 

Name:	4 Dyw. Samochodowy - żoł. -av4.jpg 
Views:	38 
Size:	205.4 KB 
ID:	581307Click image for larger version. 

Name:	4 Dyw. Samochodowy - żoł. -rev1.jpg 
Views:	49 
Size:	181.4 KB 
ID:	581308Click image for larger version. 

Name:	4 Dyw. Samochodowy - żoł. -rev2.jpg 
Views:	44 
Size:	141.0 KB 
ID:	581309

    Regards,
    Jacek


  5. #205

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    And another one - very similar to the version 1 and Tony's badge:

    Click image for larger version. 

Name:	4 DS żołnierska, awers.jpg 
Views:	24 
Size:	181.5 KB 
ID:	581310Click image for larger version. 

Name:	4 DS żołnierska, rewers.jpg 
Views:	35 
Size:	136.0 KB 
ID:	581311

    Cheers,
    Jacek

  6. #206
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    Hi Jacek
    Thank you for your response and the information provided. Too often, began to appear in the Polish Military Badges well preserved. Almost all are in doubt about the authenticity. Now we have to put our :: sign - Formacje Odeskie 1917-1918. Sign rare. Authenticity is in doubt.
    Regards,
    Alexander

  7. #207

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    Dear Alexandr,

    Because this is very expensive hobby (like each hobby treated seriously) I can only advise you that you should be very cautious.

    I have theory of 3 types of the badges:
    1. - absolutely genuine - first impression is so positive that I have no doubt on it
    2. - absolutely false - the opposite feelings to the above mentioned
    3. - and the most difficult - undefined

    With the first two kinds I do not have any problems, in the third case usually I give up. When anything is incorrect, when first impression is unsure it is better to withdraw.

    It is my philosophy.

    Cheers,
    Jacek

  8. #208
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    Click image for larger version. 

Name:	156874_1381413963.jpg 
Views:	45 
Size:	136.7 KB 
ID:	581336Click image for larger version. 

Name:	156874_1381413921.jpg 
Views:	37 
Size:	141.8 KB 
ID:	581335Click image for larger version. 

Name:	156874_1381413890.jpg 
Views:	21 
Size:	140.1 KB 
ID:	581334Click image for larger version. 

Name:	156874_1381413991.jpg 
Views:	23 
Size:	141.0 KB 
ID:	581337Click image for larger version. 

Name:	156874_1381414028.jpg 
Views:	42 
Size:	143.4 KB 
ID:	581338Click image for larger version. 

Name:	156874_1381414059.jpg 
Views:	27 
Size:	134.4 KB 
ID:	581339Click image for larger version. 

Name:	156874_1381414092.jpg 
Views:	19 
Size:	145.7 KB 
ID:	581340Click image for larger version. 

Name:	156874_1381414122.jpg 
Views:	28 
Size:	145.6 KB 
ID:	581341
    Formacje Odeskie 1917-1918

  9. #209

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    This is extremely rare badge and in my grading system the badge from the attached photos belongs to the category 2 - absolutely fake

    Please look at the pictures below - it should help you with the evaluation of the authenticity of your badge:

    Click image for larger version. 

Name:	1913485401.jpg 
Views:	50 
Size:	196.1 KB 
ID:	581364Click image for larger version. 

Name:	1913485401_1.jpg 
Views:	45 
Size:	90.0 KB 
ID:	581365

    But Alexandr do not give up

    Cheers,
    Jacek

  10. #210
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    Your badge production Knedlera
    It is interesting to see that badge production E.M.Unger (Lviv)
    Cheers,
    Alexander

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