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Cross of Valour (Krzyż Walecznych) – Pre-WW2 Types

Article about: by IvanPutski Here's another little tidbit on that cross.... It was awarded to a fighter pilot. Hello Ivan, OK, the suspense builds . . . so now how about giving us the name? The award lists

  1. #111
    3mk
    3mk is offline
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    Default Re: Cross of Valour (Krzyż Walecznych) – Pre-WW2 Types

    Hi Nvidia,

    Cross 1 appears to be a good Exile example made by Spink. Cross 2 appear to be a Pre-war cross made by Jan Knedler on a Exile ribbon, meaning the original was replaced.



    The ribbon on Cross 1 looks to be put on right, but the brass pin faces the front of the cross and not the back. Cross #2's ribbon appears to be put on backwards.

  2. #112

    Default Re: Cross of Valour (Krzyż Walecznych) – Pre-WW2 Types

    Quote by 3mk View Post
    Hi Nvidia,

    Cross 1 appears to be a good Exile example made by Spink. Cross 2 appear to be a Pre-war cross made by Jan Knedler on a Exile ribbon, meaning the original was replaced.

    The ribbon on Cross 1 looks to be put on right, but the brass pin faces the front of the cross and not the back. Cross #2's ribbon appears to be put on backwards.

    well thats good to know alteast both crosses are originals and not jewelers copys, but in terms of value am guessing the second one is worth more do to it being numbered? Also cross 1 since it is exile it's from in between 1939 -1945? And the seconds cross ribbon is probably from the same period am thinking as well.

  3. #113

    Default Re: Cross of Valour (Krzyż Walecznych) – Pre-WW2 Types

    Quote by nvidia101 View Post
    well thats good to know alteast both crosses are originals and not jewelers copys, but in terms of value am guessing the second one is worth more do to it being numbered? Also cross 1 since it is exile it's from in between 1939 -1945? And the seconds cross ribbon is probably from the same period am thinking as well.
    Hi nvidia101,

    Emil is correct, both crosses appear genuine.

    Cross 1 is a WW2 period British production cross, but not a Spink product. It has its original issue ribbon, and the fastening clasp is mounted correctly but happens to be flipped up in the pictures. This is the most common WW2 variant. There was a large quantity produced which remained available to veterans via London based retailers during the post war decades. In 1990 a large quantity of these unissued crosses was transferred to Poland and from there made their way onto the collector market.

    Cross 2 is a pre-war Type 1 Knedler government serial numbered issue, on a replacement exile ribbon installed backwards as Emil notes, insofar as the obverse typically will not have the ribbon seam visible. This cross has a market value on the order of two to three times that of Cross 1.

    Regards,
    Tony
    All thoughts and opinions expressed are those of my own and should not be mistaken for medical and/or legal advice.

    "Tomorrow hopes we have learned something from yesterday." - John Wayne

  4. #114

    Default Re: Cross of Valour (Krzyż Walecznych) – Pre-WW2 Types

    thank you for the info. what is the value of a cross like this,assuming this example is genuine:

    Click image for larger version. 

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  5. #115

    Default Re: Cross of Valour (Krzyż Walecznych) – Pre-WW2 Types

    Another Type 1 Knedler. The cross looks to be genuine. Ribon is a replacement, and the award bars are modern production. These crosses good conditrion in have been selling for $200 - $250 by themselves . A period ribbon in good condition adds significantly to the value. A low four digit serial number can easily triple the value.

    Regards,
    Tony
    All thoughts and opinions expressed are those of my own and should not be mistaken for medical and/or legal advice.

    "Tomorrow hopes we have learned something from yesterday." - John Wayne

  6. #116
    3mk
    3mk is offline
    ?

    Default Re: Cross of Valour (Krzyż Walecznych) – Pre-WW2 Types

    Hi Tony,

    I was wondering how can you identify pre-war bars from post-war/modern/fakes? I was going to post the cross in the auction threads as I noticed the ribbon is a replacement and assumed the bars were added at an attempt to increase the value. Also, sorry for mistaking the Exile cross for a Spink product! I thought it was because of the small dot over the tip of the sword. I guess I still have a lot to learn!

  7. #117

    Default Re: Cross of Valour (Krzyż Walecznych) – Pre-WW2 Types

    Quote by 3mk View Post
    Hi Tony,

    I was wondering how can you identify pre-war bars from post-war/modern/fakes? I was going to post the cross in the auction threads as I noticed the ribbon is a replacement and assumed the bars were added at an attempt to increase the value. Also, sorry for mistaking the Exile cross for a Spink product! I thought it was because of the small dot over the tip of the sword. I guess I still have a lot to learn!
    You and me both Emil. When I read the posts on exile eagles.. my head spins!

    I know that experience is a great teacher but so is in person exposure to real items and copies. Unfortunately where I live there doesn't seem to be much of either to inspect.

  8. #118

    Default Re: Cross of Valour (Krzyż Walecznych) – Pre-WW2 Types

    Hi Emil,

    Pictured below are the two pre-war award bar types. Excuse the quality, I just took these, and the bars are actually under glass. The top one is the 'government' pattern introduced in 1920, and made by Jan Knedler. The one below this was introduced in 1925, apparently by Wincenty Wabia-Wabinski and made in France by Arthus Bertrand. Both are 7mm wide and stamped out of thin brass.

    The modern knock offs I've seen are typically made from thicker metal, and don't have the stamped relief on the reverse. They also have a distinctive look and patina about them. The ones on the cross pictured above have that look, although admittedly, digital pictures can be tricky.

    Re the Spink “dot”, there’s been a lot of confusion about these crosses. Spink crosses are unique clearly identifiable, and as far as I only one type was produced. The British maker of the “dot” crosses remains unknown. So I also have a lot to learn!

    Cheers,
    Tony
    Click to enlarge the picture Click to enlarge the picture Click image for larger version. 

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    All thoughts and opinions expressed are those of my own and should not be mistaken for medical and/or legal advice.

    "Tomorrow hopes we have learned something from yesterday." - John Wayne

  9. #119

    Default Re: Cross of Valour (Krzyż Walecznych) – Pre-WW2 Types

    Quote by A.J. Zawadzki View Post
    Hi nvidia101,

    Cross 2 is a pre-war Type 1 Knedler government serial numbered issue, on a replacement exile ribbon installed backwards as Emil notes, insofar as the obverse typically will not have the ribbon seam visible. This cross has a market value on the order of two to three times that of Cross 1.

    Regards,
    Tony
    I just have a quick question for cross 2 the replacement exile ribbon is still genuine from the wwII era or is it a modern production?

  10. #120

    Default Re: Cross of Valour (Krzyż Walecznych) – Pre-WW2 Types

    Hi nvidia,

    It’s impossible to say for certain when it was made, especially from pictures alone. But regardless, it is incorrect for this cross, and again, on backwards. I’d prefer to see a modern replacement ribbon, or none at all, to an incorrect one.

    Regards,
    Tony
    All thoughts and opinions expressed are those of my own and should not be mistaken for medical and/or legal advice.

    "Tomorrow hopes we have learned something from yesterday." - John Wayne

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