wz.31 Polish Army Helmet - 100% genuine ?

**justin1939** · 12-02-2009, 04:13 PM

I have won a wz.31 Polish Army Helmet, could you tell me if it is 100% genuine, as soon as possible, please. So I can know what to tell the seller.

I have won a wz.31 Polish army helmet, could you tell me if you think it is 100% original (paint) and complete (markings stencilled and stamped metal (underneath front rim), please ?

Do you think the condition is good ? Do you think the rust is only suface rust which can be oiled ?

Do you think there is rust pushing through and spreading under the paint ?

Are the Khaki helmets, Green helmets for certain units ?

This is their description - This is Polish Army M31 Helmet Huta Ludwikow Kielce production from 1937. Great pre WW2 helmet, cork salamander cammo in medium grade, marked Ludwikow 37 and K2 stamp. Also copper control rivet stamp.Leather liner with three pockets, leather early chin strap.

Do you think it is accurate ?

I have attached the pictures.

Thank You

Justin

**Dimas** · 12-02-2009, 04:35 PM

Looks like a good helmet itself, but I can't say nothing about the sawdust camo

**3mk** · 12-02-2009, 09:16 PM

Good nice original example

**A.J. Zawadzki** · 12-03-2009, 07:36 PM

Hi Justin,

Thanks for your post and questions. First off though – these are questions you should be asking before buying anything! This cannot be overstressed, especially in the Polish militaria market.

Over to your helmet - it’s a mix of good, bad and ugly. The helmet shell itself is genuine, although I am a tad suspicious about the brass control rivet.. The interior appears to have much of its original finish. Nice to see the Ludwikow stamp and production year, although strangely it is missing the lot number. The quick-release chin strap and liner pads appear correct. May I ask what colour the fabric ‘pillows’ behind the leather pads are?.

The liner ring is not original. It has been made up for this helmet and is too narrow. The drawstring is also not original, a relatively minor point.

The all important exterior finish is not original. As you know, a majority of the helmets value resides in the originality an condition of the exterior finish. This one is a rather poor attempt at replicating the original cork anti-reflective finish. Rarely is this done convincingly, and this one isn’t even remotely close. There is also some crudely executed damage repair to the rim of the helmet which does nothing to help the value of the piece.

Justin, this helmet looks like a product of one of the more unrepentant helmet fakers on ebay – a crook operating under the name of “crocodillo” or something close to that. I recall seeing some reworked wz.31’s up for sale lately, and suspect this is one of them. He regularly lists doctored up fakes and fantasy items - and does a brisk business. This shyster is to be avoided. If you haven’t paid yet you may want to consider your options. His cleverly constructed item descriptions make it difficult to hook him as being outright fraudulent, so you’ll need to find something. Where’s a lawyer when you need one? Good luck.

Regards,
Tony

**IvanPutski** · 12-03-2009, 08:02 PM

What amazes me about certain sellers of helmets on eBay is that they come up with a whole slew of the rarest of Polish helmets, while they profess not to know anything at all about them (because they are not the experts), which of course is the reason why they are leaving it up to the buyer to decide on the originality from the photos, and why there is a policy of No Returns.

What's wrong with this picture?

**IvanPutski** · 12-03-2009, 08:09 PM

Case in point. These are the eagles from four SBSK helmets all offered and sold for good money within the span of a couple of months on eBay, all from the same source. As some of you know, I limit my collecting to helmets of the Polish Armed Forces in Exile in WW2. Take it from me, this is one of the rarest and most sought after pieces in that area of collecting. What's wrong with this picture?

**IvanPutski** · 12-03-2009, 08:27 PM

By the way... for what it's worth... I concur with our moderator's assessment of the Wz.31, especially about the finish, which it appears that someone tried to replicate and failed miserably in the attempt....

**A.J. Zawadzki** · 12-03-2009, 09:09 PM

by IvanPutski

By the way... for what it's worth... I concur with our moderator's assessment of the Wz.31, especially about the finish, which it appears that someone tried to replicate and failed miserably in the attempt....

Hi Ivan,

Thanks for the support. I’ve owned several over the years, and as with anything, once one is familiar with the real thing the counterfeits stand out like the proverbial sore thumb.

For the record – the link below is for a superb surviving example that sold yesterday. The price reflects the quality of the piece. Justin, I recommend that you (and others including 3mk who posted on this thread) archive the pictures from this auction for future reference. Disciplined archiving of images from the internet is a great way of learning about the objects of our desire, and also will eventually result in an invaluable reference library.

Also, there is a thread on these helmets elsewhere on this forum. Study the pictures posted there and you will go a long way to protecting yourselves from buying the garbage that litters the marketplace.

ELMETTO POLACCO WZ31 POLISH HELMET STAHLHELM WW2 WWII on eBay.ca (item 300370073134 end time 02-Dec-09 17:51:00 EST)

Regards,
Tony

**IvanPutski** · 12-03-2009, 09:52 PM

by IvanPutski

Case in point. These are the eagles from four SBSK helmets all offered and sold for good money within the span of a couple of months on eBay, all from the same source. As some of you know, I limit my collecting to helmets of the Polish Armed Forces in Exile in WW2. Take it from me, this is one of the rarest and most sought after pieces in that area of collecting. What's wrong with this picture?

And furthermore.... although I said they sold for "good money" (meaning several hundred dollars apiece), they still all went for multiples less than what a known original would go for (if you could find one)....

**A.J. Zawadzki** · 12-03-2009, 10:14 PM

by IvanPutski

Case in point. These are the eagles from four SBSK helmets all offered and sold for good money within the span of a couple of months on eBay, all from the same source. As some of you know, I limit my collecting to helmets of the Polish Armed Forces in Exile in WW2. Take it from me, this is one of the rarest and most sought after pieces in that area of collecting. What's wrong with this picture?

Well done Ivan to save these images! Yes, I definitely remember these helmets offered by this seller earlier this year. I also remember the stir created amongst the collecting marketplace when the first one was listed. Things died down quickly after the second, third and so one of these incredibly rare helmets magically appeared for sale. But that didn’t stop the seller from seeing some handsome closing prices for these auctions.

Take note of the similarity in the stenciled eagles on the one with the netting and the last picture posted. Both from the same production close to seven decades ago . . . or from 2009 ?? You decide . . .

T.