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Polish Paratroopers BD

Article about: Hello, I have always wanted to add an original Polish Paratroopers BD to my collection. However, my knowledge and feel for this area is limited. I have been offered a BD that is very similar

  1. #1

    Default Polish Paratroopers BD

    Hello, I have always wanted to add an original Polish Paratroopers BD to my collection. However, my knowledge and feel for this area is limited. I have been offered a BD that is very similar to this one that is offered on allegro (BD only). I am not sure if the allegro one is original,

    mundur brygady spad. (1259395519) - Aukcje internetowe Allegro

    but the one that I have been offered is 100% authentic and unmessed. It has the metal pattern collar kites, 3 metal (braided style) stars on each shoulder, and a ribbon bar indicated that the owner was awarded a VM KW and a Bronze Merit with swords. The tunic is a British BD dated 1944.
    The asking price is $1000, could someone please advise if this is a fair price, or if it is a stretch. Thanks in advance
    The owner also has an original warsztatowka type para jump wings with wreath - asking $400 is this fair? Sorry I cannot offer photos, although that would make things easier. I dont have my camera and this was a spur of the moment contact.
    Any help will be greatly appreciated. I know many of us here are not collecting for the dollar value, but to preserve and appreciate the history, however I would prefer to pay reasonable going rates.

  2. #2
    ?

    Default Re: Polish Paratroopers BD

    I'm not keen on this BD for a couple of reasons ...
    1)The Backing to the collar badges looks too large.
    2)The "Poland" titles are the type I would expect to see on 2nd Corp clothing, and are the type an officer would use.
    3)The oversmock is not the type I would like to see with the BD.

    All in all ... I would pass ..

    Gary J.
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  3. #3
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    Default Re: Polish Paratroopers BD

    The 2nd BD ....
    photo's are really needed at the price it is being sold at.
    .. Also, the only Kpt. in the Brigade who was awarded the VM was with the Medical company, and so the collars SHOULD NOT be of the kite style, but rhomboid (coffin shaped), and coloured coded to the medics and not the airborne infantry.

    Gary J.

  4. #4
    ?

    Default Re: Polish Paratroopers BD

    Also, http://www.falleneagle.com/shop/viewphoto.php?x=0 has a "Polish Airborne" BD for sale ....
    BUT there seems to be a contradiction in the badges ...
    The collars are to the Airborne infantry, ... but it looks like there was a SF wing on the right arm.
    The SF wing would have been with the Grenadier Company whose collars were of a different colour !!

    It's a real minefield out there !!

    Gary J

  5. #5
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    Default Re: Polish Paratroopers BD

    ..and ..the BD dosent seem to be tailored in the Polish style..perhaps why it is folded over so as not to see the non..tailoring?

  6. #6

    Default Re: Polish Paratroopers BD ADDITIONAL PHOTOS

    Thanks Gary and Dorava for your comments,
    Here are a few photos of the BD - please let me know what you think and if $1000 is an OK price.
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  7. #7

    Default Re: Polish Paratroopers BD ADDITIONAL PHOTOS

    P.S.

    Gary, the rank stars are on prongs, perhaps they were added later (maybe the veteran got promoted and added them). At any rate, I am confident in your expertise and welcome any comments

  8. #8

    Default Re: Polish Paratroopers BD

    Quote by BDinExile View Post
    . . . but the one that I have been offered is 100% authentic and unmessed. It has the metal pattern collar kites, 3 metal (braided style) stars on each shoulder, and a ribbon bar indicated that the owner was awarded a VM KW and a Bronze Merit with swords. The tunic is a British BD dated 1944.
    The asking price is $1000, could someone please advise if this is a fair price, or if it is a stretch. Thanks in advance
    The owner also has an original warsztatowka type para jump wings with wreath - asking $400 is this fair? Sorry I cannot offer photos, although that would make things easier. I dont have my camera and this was a spur of the moment contact.
    Any help will be greatly appreciated. I know many of us here are not collecting for the dollar value, but to preserve and appreciate the history, however I would prefer to pay reasonable going rates.
    Agreed with Gary and dorava, that BD on Allegro has more red flags than a Maoist rally.

    And regarding the one you have been offered, how do you know that it is ‘100% authentic and unmessed’? This is the crucial question. Before getting to the matter of whether or not the asking price is fair you’ll first need to take some very cautious and methodical steps to authenticate the piece. Posting pics here is strongly recommended. You could be on the trail of a real treasure, or a waste of hard earned money.

    As far as the badge, only original official issue badges carry the real value. If this tunic is proved genuine to a named veteran and you have solid provenance associating this badge as ‘warsztatowka’ replacement for this veteran then it has value and both items should be kept together. If it’s just a random badge being offered to you then it falls into 99.7% of Polish para wings out there – a relatively worthless copy.

    Regards,
    Tony
    All thoughts and opinions expressed are those of my own and should not be mistaken for medical and/or legal advice.

    "Tomorrow hopes we have learned something from yesterday." - John Wayne

  9. #9

    Default Re: Polish Paratroopers BD

    BDinExile - Oops – we were cross posting. Thanks for the pics. Just a couple of quick comments, more later. I like the shoulder titles – correct type and look like they’ve been there a while. The rank stars appear to be correct WW2 period British made (should have smooth back, not “hollow” stamped). As this appears to have been a ‘best’ BD tunic I am a bit wary of the lack of the custom open tailored collar, especially for a captain rank. I would also be a tad more comfortable seeing a non-austerity pattern BD. That’s not to say that this one is technically incorrect, but an officer with a VM to his credit did have some pull at landing a better grade of tunic. Lastly, it would be good to see a sharply focused close up of the collar tabs to assess the badge.

    Is the seller providing a name (or is there one marked inside), and anyy past history of how he acquired it?

    Regards,
    T.
    All thoughts and opinions expressed are those of my own and should not be mistaken for medical and/or legal advice.

    "Tomorrow hopes we have learned something from yesterday." - John Wayne

  10. #10
    ?

    Default Re: Polish Paratroopers BD

    Good points Tony ....
    .. For some reason I have the gut feeling all is not as it should be ....
    I am dubious of the medal ribbon block ....
    I have the feeling that the BD has been got to, and there are additions of which I'm unsure.

    The VM ribbon immediately worries me, as there were only a hand full of VM's awarded to the 1SBS at Arnhem.
    .. As mentioned, the only VM KPT was in the medical company, and thus the collars don't match up .. either for medical company or officer !!
    Also, the definition of the metal parachutist's on the collars looks a little vague ... I would want crystal clear images of these badges, as they are the only 1SBS purely issued items on the BD if original.

    Therefore, I suspect this might have been an other ranks BD (Airborne infantry), which has been "enhanced", which totally muddies the water.

    Probably best to let the BD pass by, as it is unclear to what section/unit of the 1SBS it might have been originally designated.

    And rightly, as Tony has said, if the seller is 100% sure of the BD, he must in reality have further information about the original owner ...

    Regards

    Gary J.

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