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Uniforms and Insignia of the Polish Underground State

Article about: by dastier PPsh 41 in use during the Warsaw Uprising. Where would AK battle group "GURT" have sourced these Russian weapons? During the Rising or earlier from Russian partisan grou

  1. #81

    Default Re: Uniforms and Insignia of the Polish Underground State

    To get an opinion as to how the Polish partisans would have acquired the M31 Suomi submachineguns. (Finnish designation: Kp/31), I posted photos of the AK unit operating in Radom-Kielce in another forum.

    In response it was suggested that those SMGs would have been captured from German Police irregulars or SS Police Division units and possibly Waffen SS. Here is a photo showing a Kp/31 Suomi being used by member of the bodyguard of SS and Police Leader of Warsaw, Jürgen Stroop, during the liquidation of the Warsaw Ghetto in 1943. (left background)

    Click image for larger version. 

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    Also a German SS soldier is armed with a MP28 Bergmann submachinegun on the right. One of the previous AK unit photos shows a partisan possibly armed with a Bergmann.

  2. #82

    Default Re: Uniforms and Insignia of the Polish Underground State

    Quote by dastier View Post
    To get an opinion as to how the Polish partisans would have acquired the M31 Suomi submachineguns. (Finnish designation: Kp/31), I posted photos of the AK unit operating in Radom-Kielce in another forum.

    In response it was suggested that those SMGs would have been captured from German Police irregulars or SS Police Division units and possibly Waffen SS.
    A very plausible scenario because on 26 September 1944 in the woods surrounding Przysucha 72 pp AK (photo source) and 25 pp AK fought an all-day battle with Wehrmacht and SS units and the following day they successfully attacked the police station in Przysucha!
    I collect, therefore I am.

    Nothing in science can explain how consciousness arose from matter.

  3. #83

    Default Re: Uniforms and Insignia of the Polish Underground State

    Has anyone got in there collections any Opaski (Armbands)?

    I have added a few pics of some here, some seem to be printed and some embroided and stitched, i think they would be hard items to verify as original if found.

    The BCh had two types of bands, the B.Ch.(Bataliony Chłopskie- The Peasants Battalions) and the L.Z.K(Ludowy Związek Kobiet- The peoples union of women)
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    The Bataliony Chłopskie armbands seem to be sewn, and the AK ones printed, im not sure whether that was a consistant process as i cant find many pictures.
    Click image for larger version. 

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    This photo below i took myself in the imperial War museum in London, its one of the very few Polish Military/Partyzan items they have.
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    So far i have not seen any Opaska of the NSZ, i wonder if any here has any photos or owns such an item?

  4. #84

    Default Re: Uniforms and Insignia of the Polish Underground State

    Another photo for uniforms and weapons in use :-)

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    Below AK battle group "GURT" Warsaw Rising 1944:




    ...and a close-up of the M31 Suomi for dastier
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    I collect, therefore I am.

    Nothing in science can explain how consciousness arose from matter.

  5. #85
    ?

    Default Re: Uniforms and Insignia of the Polish Underground State

    Good pic of the wz 1928 in action too.

  6. #86

    Default Re: Uniforms and Insignia of the Polish Underground State

    The suomi was called "Finka" by Polish Partisans, especially ones around Wilno.

  7. #87

    Default Re: Uniforms and Insignia of the Polish Underground State

    Hi Emil,

    A couple of photos Lublin AK

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    I collect, therefore I am.

    Nothing in science can explain how consciousness arose from matter.

  8. #88

    Default Re: Uniforms and Insignia of the Polish Underground State

    Does this text I found online (Youtube) re "Finka" help explain how such weapons were in Polish underground hands?



    "My Grandma fought in 2nd Polish Peoples Army 1943-45 against Germans. They were tought and lead by Soviet officers in Polish uniforms. They learned from Russians, that the weapon PPSH 41 is called, Finka. And so they used the name. Perhaps only the drum magazine was copied. However, it was the drum magazine (is it two row?), that made it so very special."

    Jacek Kotowski 1 year ago

    "They called PPSh Finka because its predecessor (PPD) was introduced to the Army during the winter war.

    Finland started factory to produce "pirated" Soviet PPsh and PPS in during 1942-43. They were much cheaper then homegrown Suomi"
    I collect, therefore I am.

    Nothing in science can explain how consciousness arose from matter.

  9. #89

    Default Re: Uniforms and Insignia of the Polish Underground State

    I can't see Finland making copies of the PPsh 41 - that's some sort of Russian propaganda. The PPsh used a different caliber bullet. It would cause the Finns to waste precious resources retooling. Not to mention there was nothing seriously wrong with the Suomi - it remained in Finnish service into the 50s.

    It was the other way around - the Russians copied the Finns. Russians may have called their own PPshs 'Finka' because of the similarity in appearance and passed the name along to the Poles.

    That Finnish soldiers might pick up and use PPsh 41 submachineguns during battle and resupply ammunition from dead Russian soldiers - I can believe.

    As the PPS were being manufactured in Leningrad during the siege, I'm sure the Finns captured some. Again the caliber was not 9mm which is what the Finns used in the Suomi. However I did find that eventually the Finns made a copy called the M/44 submachinegun chambered in 9mm. They just did not issue them in WW2.


    PPsh 41 in use during the Warsaw Uprising.


  10. #90

    Default Re: Uniforms and Insignia of the Polish Underground State

    A quick overview of the weapons shown in the photos:

    Polish partisans armed with a Sten (standing) and Russian Degtyaryov DP 28 LMG.



    Standing partisans (left, middle, right): Luger pistol in belt, not shown, Maschinenpistole 38/40, P.38 pistol in belt, unknown pistol in holster.

    Sitting partisans (left, center, right): Sturmgewehr 44, Russian PPsh 41, Sturmgewehr 44.

    On ground: Maschinengewehr 34, the one on the left appears to have a modified butt stock.


    And finally, the consensus of opinion from Gunboards.com is that this is one of the Kp/31 exported to Poland in 1933 and used by the Policja Państwowa.

    Last edited by dastier; 10-01-2012 at 10:30 PM.

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