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Sa dagger with full röhm dedication

Article about: Hi there! I was offered today for purchase this SA dagger with full Röhm dedication... Please let me know your thoughts on it, genuine or copy, as the seller is waiting for a definitive resp

  1. #21

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    Quote by Larry C View Post
    Discrepancies on the lettering lead me to believe that this dedication was reapplied after comparing another period Wingen type. The logo is correct including the Gruppe mark that designated Rohm daggers to this SA gruppe. The statement made above leaves me uncomfortable with the motto and dedication being opposite depth.
    Thank your seller for the extra photos..they were of great help . The horizontal condition of the reverse blade 9 times out of 10 when we see it with Rohm dagger types always seem to have this rubbed over scratched surfacing. IMO only...something to hide? I also feel you have doubts Jose...if you feel the seller is reliable..then why is this dagger posted?
    This is not an attack on you or the seller..but a common sense statement..begs this question.

    To be honest...this is one of these daggers too close to call..and requires an in hand inspection. The area from the tip of the blade for some odd reason is brighter in appearance..than after the Rohm signanture..it becomes darkened..... including the lettering issues I see on the dedication. Full commonly seen Full Rohms like Eickhorn and Ernst Pack..in this condition will start at 7K.

    Again IMO only someone must of done their Homework as Anton Wingen Full Rohms are not as common to find. That a authentic Wingen blade was acquired..and a dedication reapplied. Would be worth more to Rohm collectors than 7K. After further study and research..and also what was presented on this thread in photos and in text...observations of any tang markings and billet clamp marks would be beneficial including an in hand inspection..I would walk away and keep that large amount of money in your pocket. Better to walk away disappointed and rich than having empty pockets and an empty promise in your collection. I welcome any other comments or ideas..as I have nothing more to add then what has already been said.

    I like the dagger..it has a great fit1 Regards Larry

    Hi Larry!


    Thank you so much for your well reasoned opinion on the dagger, you are a real expert in these matters! I really felt the seller was reliable, because in the past he sold me some three authentic SA daggers and he was also a collector. He sent me photos of the collection he owned in the past, which was composed of a few hundreads items including daggers, swords, etc. However I did not feel 100% comfortable regarding this dagger, because the asking price was just 2500 euros and one knows that if it were authentic would be worth 3 times more!

    After carefully viewing the new photos and contrast them more (I have attached them again), I realized myself that some of the horizontal scratches in the central part of the blade seem to be quite deep... You stated that most of the blades with full Röhm dedication shows these features. And why? Could these have been re-etched all them?

    Thanks for your valuable help , I will pass on this dagger!

    Very best regards,


    Jose

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  3. #22

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    Dont blame too much the seller....they only know enough of what they study..the rest is up to you the buyer to decide if it passes your test. Blind dates can swing both ways also..best to keep researching before jumping into bed..and regret a mistake you made.

    Those 3 SA daggers?..Im sure they are fine...I would like to see them at your convenience. Seek a reputable dealer..a very well known one when dealing in daggers and swords. Two I recommend highly...... Lakesidetrader | German WWII Daggers & Medals and Wittmann Antique Militaria

    Most importantly..it is your desire and knowledge of the subject..that needs strengthening. Always read, study and compare..if this is the course you seek to take. You will benefit in the long run..what was thought difficult to attain.... will be 2nd nature cool miitaria. Regards Larry
    It is not the size of a Collection in History that matters......Its the size of your Passion for it!! - Larry C

    One never knows what tree roots push to the surface of what laid buried before the tree was planted - Larry C

    “The farther back you can look, the farther forward you are likely to see.” - Winston Churchill

  4. #23

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    Larry I concur with your feelings on this.
    We now have our archives up and the last two years of sales loaded. I mention this because it can provide some reference for collectors. We have sold several Wingen Rohms including a couple full Rohms the past several years.
    https://www.lakesidetrader.com/Archi...em.php?ID=8550
    https://www.lakesidetrader.com/Archi...em.php?ID=8993
    https://www.lakesidetrader.com/Archi...em.php?ID=9384

    Harvey you bring up a great question which I would like to clarify as there is some confusion and misinformation around the maker mark on these.
    The Wingen Rohms were produced with the maker mark close to the crossguard AND located in the same location as the non-Rohms. Non Rohms all had the maker mark located far from the crossguard.
    I hope that makes sense. In other words if the maker mark is close to the crossguard 100% that was a Rohm dagger. If far from the crossguard it possibly was.
    One of the 1st tests on these daggers is the dedication the exact same depth and color as the motto and maker mark. This one fails on test #1.
    Very good informative discussion.

  5. #24

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    I think Paul is right with this dagger

  6. #25

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    Quote by Larry C View Post
    Dont blame too much the seller....they only know enough of what they study..the rest is up to you the buyer to decide if it passes your test. Blind dates can swing both ways also..best to keep researching before jumping into bed..and regret a mistake you made.

    Those 3 SA daggers?..Im sure they are fine...I would like to see them at your convenience. Seek a reputable dealer..a very well known one when dealing in daggers and swords. Two I recommend highly...... Lakesidetrader | German WWII Daggers & Medals and Wittmann Antique Militaria

    Most importantly..it is your desire and knowledge of the subject..that needs strengthening. Always read, study and compare..if this is the course you seek to take. You will benefit in the long run..what was thought difficult to attain.... will be 2nd nature cool miitaria. Regards Larry

    You are right Larry, I still need to learn a lot about Third Reich militaria! I don't blame the seller, as he has been always a kind person and I think he may be acting in good faith. I no longer have the daggers he sold me, I exchanged them for a good LW sword... I will show you a photo, but I am out of camera at the moment

    Again many thanks, I'll be posting whenever I have questions on specific items and hope I can count on your valuable help again

    Very best regards,


    Jose

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