Third Reich Armbands – Type & Date Identification – With Pictures

[Oroman]

Hello all!

I would like to enquire about identifying the type/variation of these armbands and if it is possible to date them approximately from construction type.

Any knowledge offered will be appreciated.

N.B. I realise that some of these photos have the incorrect orientation. I have only just found up that by taking all photos in landscape mode is the way to avoid this. Please forgive me this time.

Thank you!

Duncan. ⭐️

[Oroman]

Also, I recently read on this forum about the 'smell test' with materials such as these. Would somebody care to elaborate on what this might mean for the two armbands in question?

Thank you.

[Rossi]

Also, I recently read on this forum about the 'smell test' with materials such as these. Would somebody care to elaborate on what this might mean for the two armbands in question?

Thank you.

There is an odor of 3rd reich era material / cloth that is musty and smoky. Nothing rocket science about it but you can tell newer fabric from older once you have collected for years. The weave and cloth types is also something to learn to look for. You can also try the burn test. Old thread burns quickly and leaves ash, whereas modern synthetic fakes burn and ball up into plasticky bobbles. Black light can also assist if fabric glows. Although some materials washed with detergents post war can make them glow due to phosphates in detergent. I would like to inspect your kamfbindes in hand. I have seen these turn out fine but by looking at them the roundels and stitching does concern me they could be 1960's repros. I am on the fence on these a bit. I will say the Sports Armband stands a chance based on look of weave. See what other cloth gurus think here. I learned alot from failing, My Opa taught me a bunch and Bob Coleman was a good resource and mentor for me. The best medicine is study and years of experience. Going to shows and handling and sniffing these puppies makes a world of difference. I am not an expert but these are my tidbits of knowledge. We all have been fooled.

Here is my Sports Kampfbinde for your review: SA Sports Armband
Here is my NSDAP version Kampfbinde for your review: NSDAP Armband

[Rakkasan187]

I can only echo what Rossi has so eloquently stated. Studying and research are two main proponents of the hobby.

The NSDAP armband felt looks very rough, as though it had been washed many times. If this is the case, the black light test may be a false negative or positive result, meaning that it may glow significantly. The thread that is attaching the roundel to the felt may also glow, indicating synthetic vs cotton thread. The red felt in these images looks very course and not smooth. Not necessarily a red flag warning but I agree that to inspect it in person and in hand would be beneficial. Since that is not possible, we will go by the photos and other known examples of authentic armbands. I remain skeptical about the NSDAP armband being Pre-May 1945 made.

I am not a fan of the SA sports armband, I have never seen one of this manufacturing, and is quite possibly this is a 1960s reproduction. I don't like the direct embroidery of the emblem onto the cloth material. All known original examples were two piece construction where the white disc was embroidered and then sewn to the red armband. You can see this in Rossi's example that he provided the link to.

Smitty

[Rossi]

I can only echo what Rossi has so eloquently stated. Studying and research are two main proponents of the hobby.

The NSDAP armband felt looks very rough, as though it had been washed many times. If this is the case, the black light test may be a false negative or positive result, meaning that it may glow significantly. The thread that is attaching the roundel to the felt may also glow, indicating synthetic vs cotton thread. The red felt in these images looks very course and not smooth. Not necessarily a red flag warning but I agree that to inspect it in person and in hand would be beneficial. Since that is not possible, we will go by the photos and other known examples of authentic armbands. I remain skeptical about the NSDAP armband being Pre-May 1945 made.

I am not a fan of the SA sports armband, I have never seen one of this manufacturing, and is quite possibly this is a 1960s reproduction. I don't like the direct embroidery of the emblem onto the cloth material. All known original examples were two piece construction where the white disc was embroidered and then sewn to the red armband. You can see this in Rossi's example that he provided the link to.

Smitty

Good stuff brother Smitty. Thanks for your expertise as always. Rossi

[Oroman]

Great reply! Thank you!

I understand what you mean regarding the ‘smell test.’ While I am largely a novice in this area, I have dealt in coins and other antiques for some time and so I do know what to look out for in some of the more intangible areas of collecting.

These certainly do not look nor smell new, but obviously this is just one part of the analysis, and like you say they could be older copies.

From the research I have done, as well as my intuition, they are genuine in my eyes, but obviously I am still learning and I wouldn’t be posting here if I didn’t value the advice and opinions of others who collect in this area.

You’ve hit the nail on the head regarding the knowledge game. I’ve never been to a militaria show, but I do many coin shows and handling the items you collect and deal in is the surest way to build a familiar and a deeper knowledge.

Let’s see what others folks think on here.

Thank you again.

Duncan.

[Oroman]

Thank you, Smitty.

I appreciate that it’s always better to have the items in hand when assessing authenticity.

The NSDAP armband feels soft in hand. It is certainly worn, spotted and stained, and it has a rather musty unpleasant smell, so if it is a copy then it’s most definitely an earlier one.

I have seen a couple of other examples of the SA Sports armband online which are identical in form to mine. That said, these could all be copies too!

Thank you for your insight.

Duncan.

[NSDAP Sammler]

IMO these are both Fakes. Artificially aged.

[Oroman]

Thank you for your assessment.

I will try them with a UV light and add that to part of the overall assessment. I believe you may be right, however.

Regards,

Duncan.