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Danziger in the big wide world

Article about: Another example of the pre-1934 wear of the second pattern Death's Head is the photo of Himmler & Wolff at the opening of the Reichstag on 12th Dec. 1933: https://www.warrelics.eu/forum/

  1. #1

    Default Danziger in the big wide world

    On the other site, a seeker asked about the cap badges many of us analyze, the Danziger Totenkopf as worn in the old armies, the Wehrmacht and the SS .

    The Google results show that our website is the treasure trove of relevant and real objects of this kind.


    Thanks to the masters here and those of you who have built this site so we stand out for the correct reasons.

    https://www.google.co.uk/search?q=pa...skull&tbm=isch

    - - ------- - -

    Knowledge drives out its opposite.
    damit, basta.

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  3. #2

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    Click image for larger version. 

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ID:	719771The object in question....
    damit, basta.

  4. #3

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    The shown death head pattern came into being in 1925 for the SS and was worn until about late
    spring 1934 as when the new pattern came into being (just global and most of you will know):
    first a part from "Die Uniformen der Braunhemden" from Freiherr von Eelking from March 1934;
    the second is the drawing as published in the "Mitteilungsblatt der RZM" from June 1934.

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    "Wir sollen auch unser Leben für die Brüder lassen" (1.Joh.3.16):
    zum Gedächtnis Wilhelm Schenk. Er starb fürs Vaterland am 13. Juni 1916

  5. #4

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ID:	719853Mr. Wim has proven my point as to why this site is so vastly superior to the competition. He has generously chosen two fine illustrations from the epoch and added them here for the knowledge and pleasure of us all. Thanks to Wim for all he has done for us all with his very fine books and his wonderful posts. He has greatly elevated the already high level of inquiry here.
    damit, basta.

  6. #5

    Default

    Here is a source of fakes, which is not without interest since we get so many questions.

    You can see that all these Danziger are made by this well known California USA firm.

    German Metal Cap Insignia
    Last edited by Friedrich-Berthold; 07-26-2014 at 05:21 AM.
    damit, basta.

  7. #6

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    Thanks as always Wim for the period material. Although most sources still refer to Spring of 1934 as the date of introduction of the so-called second pattern skull here is a still I have posted before of Xavier Schwarz at the 1933 Nuremberg Rally sporting that pattern of skull.
    d'Alquen
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  8. #7
    MAP
    MAP is online now
    ?

    Default

    Quote by Friedrich-Berthold View Post
    On the other site, a seeker asked about the cap badges many of us analyze, the Danziger Totenkopf as worn in the old armies, the Wehrmacht and the SS .

    The Google results show that our website is the treasure trove of relevant and real objects of this kind.


    Thanks to the masters here and those of you who have built this site so we stand out for the correct reasons.

    https://www.google.co.uk/search?q=pa...skull&tbm=isch

    - - ------- - -

    Knowledge drives out its opposite.
    FB, you left yourself out of the "Thanks", so I will add it in! While I'm still struggling to learn the ins and outs of this hobby, I eagerly look forward to reading all of your posts!

    Michael
    "Please", Thank You" and proper manners appreciated

    My greatest fear is that one day I will die and my wife will sell my guns for what I told her I paid for them

    "Don't tell me these are investments if you never intend to sell anything" (Quote: Wife)

  9. #8

    Default

    Quote by MAP View Post
    FB, you left yourself out of the "Thanks", so I will add it in! While I'm still struggling to learn the ins and outs of this hobby, I eagerly look forward to reading all of your posts!

    Michael
    Thank you, Michael, you are too kind.

    I have had some experience elsewhere with all of this odd pursuit, this novel approach to knowledge, and I am deeply grateful to the proprietors here and all the fine membership for all their collaboration.
    damit, basta.

  10. #9

    Default

    "Although most sources still refer to Spring of 1934 as the date of introduction of the so-called second pattern skull here is a still I have posted before of Xavier Schwarz at the 1933 Nuremberg Rally sporting that pattern of skull. d'Alquen"

    Thanks mr. d'Alquen. This is what was told to me after volume 4 was released, but I never had found a photograph, or
    document neither, stating this. Do you have information about the change of the pattern? Freiherr von Eelking, with some
    occasions and matters, was "running behind the facts". He ended his writings in March 1934, as with this the addendum
    material was included and corrections were given (Nachtrag und Berichtigungen). He did not mention the new pattern!

    As known to me with some regularity a new planned insignia or uniform-item was worn during a (short) period of what I
    would phrase as "Trageversuch". Could the change of pattern have to do with the institution for the "Leibstandarte Adolf Hitler"
    and for this a new pattern was required?? Or did it have to do with the August 3, 1933 order about insignia and uniform for the SS
    (mit dem Erscheinen ist nunmehr Mitte August 1933 zu rechnen).
    In this order it was said that with the entry of January 1, 1934 no insignia was to be worn, which was or were not according to
    the new regulations. A death head pattern with a new design must have been the goal for the SS!!
    "Wir sollen auch unser Leben für die Brüder lassen" (1.Joh.3.16):
    zum Gedächtnis Wilhelm Schenk. Er starb fürs Vaterland am 13. Juni 1916

  11. #10

    Default

    The Trageversuch point made above is germane and suggestive in this connection.
    If you read the Rest Militaria books in their number, they explain this field testing aspect of regalia and militaria in
    great detail, as do Mr. Saris' own wonderful books.
    That is, experimental things get tested out before they are introduced or not.
    The correspondence on the 2d pattern SS cap eagle is revealing as to the origins of the badge
    in the Eigenmaechtigkeit of the LAH, who, no doubt, also aped their leader who was willful in his clothing. The LAH persons
    insisted on wearing the army cap badge.

    For those who do not know, the image Mr. d'Alquen shows of Max Amann and Franz Xavier Schwarz at Nuremberg in September 1933 is from
    Riefenstahl's Sieg des Glaubens film, which is easily seen in the internet.
    It was the dry run for the film of the next year on the party rally.

    In addition to Wim's work, this firm has the very best works on militaria, whereby the system of regalia and military clothing is well explained.

    Willkommen beim Verlag Militaria!
    Last edited by Friedrich-Berthold; 07-26-2014 at 09:49 PM.
    damit, basta.

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