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SS Totenkof...real / fake

Article about: Hi guys, I was hoping to get your opinion on this TK. I been trying to decide for myself, but i just cant seem to make that call for myself yet. I went thru my collection of pics of known or

  1. #1

    Default SS Totenkof...real / fake

    Hi guys,

    I was hoping to get your opinion on this TK.
    I been trying to decide for myself, but i just cant seem to make that call for myself yet.

    I went thru my collection of pics of known originals an fakes, but i am not convinced of my abbilty to recognize the signs of fake insignia like these yet.

    as i browsed to thru all pictures of knows fakes and known originals i really got a mixed feeling on this one

    the first 30 minutes i was sure it was a fake, then i stummbled upon a photo wich was posted by a war relics member (F-B) and there were some pretty good simmilarities between the tk's
    So the next 20 minutes i was kind of thinking it might be a original..

    I like the front, even if it is not as sharp as for example a nice assmann tk..but still i like it
    The back just keeps putting me off, i really dont like the prongs on this one, also the stamp i cant really identify

    Let me know what you think..
    Attached Images Attached Images   

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  3. #2

    Default Re: SS Totenkof...real / fake

    doesnt look to hot does it? but iam with you i know really nothing about thes tk insignia sorry!

  4. #3

    Default Re: SS Totenkof...real / fake

    yeah..i really am trying to gather as much info/pics and pointers as i can on this subject, but its so complicated that it will take me at least a few more years to become educated enough to hopefully recognize the obvious fakes...wich can be a pain for the newbie's...cos there are so much out there :@

  5. #4

    Default Re: SS Totenkof...real / fake

    The thing you posted is a fake, sadly.

    You cannot learn these things from internet pictures, I am sorry to say.

    I wish I could be more help, but I am only able to post the images I have; I no longer own a camera; I am a terrible photographer of close ups; there is a highly limited supply of real badges for sale at very high prices with a few people of knowledge.

    Sorry not to be of greater use.

    This badge here is authentic, but its reverse is totally different from what you have posted.
    Click to enlarge the picture Click to enlarge the picture Click image for larger version. 

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    damit, basta.

  6. #5

    Default Re: SS Totenkof...real / fake

    Quote by Friedrich-Berthold View Post
    You cannot learn these things from internet pictures,
    FB, how very true that is. There's nothing like the smell of old badges in the morning

    someone said that in a film (AN)

    I call them armchair experts

  7. #6

    Default Re: SS Totenkof...real / fake

    Quote by John Brandon View Post
    FB, how very true that is. There's nothing like the smell of old badges in the morning

    someone said that in a film (AN)

    I call them armchair experts

    Sorry, and I do not want to seem like an enormous creep, but I look at these little thingies every day with my fading eyesight (whereby I cannot spot the things others can see in electric pictures) and the actual look and feel (though I do not feel them, of course, much, because they would further degrade with breath, spit and sweat...) cannot be proffered in the electric pictures...full stop. The monsters of fakery have used all our electric pictures to make better fakes to entrap all the earnest and eager souls fascinated by cap badges and who are seduced by same electric images to collect these terrible things. It is a catch 22 situation, in which I do not wish to appear like an a$$ hole by saying that the whole thing is impossible. Our young seekers need the stewardship of someone who is honest, as well as someone who owns say twenty of these little silly pieces of junk in their variety so as to find one's way. By a twist of fate, I own more than one of these things, but I cannot photograph them properly and I also cannot offer my young friends the Fingerspitzengefuehl necessary to secure the real thing. I apologize, but es ist halt so.

    As one is as much fascinated with all this death cult kitsch symbolism after 44 years as the eager beginner, the key therein is to understand where, how, and with what materials German regalia makers worked in the era 1880-1940 and then to internalize said knowledge.

    There should also be some international study collection of actual pieces which one could use against a fee, in fact.

    My suggestions are completely impractical, but they are also the only way to learn, save wasting thousands and thousands of dollars or Euros in a bitter process of trial and error.

    Four places to begin are: the army museum in Ingolstadt, Bavaria and Vienna, Austria, as well as that in Dresden and the Zeughaus in Berlin. These places have leading collections, good curators, and the links to other museums of applied arts and crafts which are also necessary to understand who made these things and how.

    If I did not have to earn my living and pay all my growing bills, and had I easy access to these nice places, then I would do it.

    The alternative is the archaeology of the badges themselves, which, however leads to some pretty odd and funny conclusions that have little to do with history and wie es eigentlich gewesen.

    Happy buntmetall to all my readers.

    I am going to Munich now (in fact) and I shall conjure the ghost of Deschler and his magic formula for Kupal as a gift to the world.

    Postscriptum: this badge is laughing at us because of all the riddles it and its brethern have left for the year 2009.
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    damit, basta.

  8. #7

    Default Re: SS Totenkof...real / fake

    i never said that looking at pictures and comparing them is a way of deciding on the originality of the item.
    What i meant is that it can help sometimes in filtering out the obvious fakes.
    If i for example am interrested in buying a badge i first will have a long hard look and try to get a feel of it. just for the sake of trying to create a gut feeling.
    then i start browsing the books and compare with the pics of known fakes.
    if i cant find any fakes in this database wich show any similarities then i start to dig deeper and do a search on this forum..when all fails or i am still in doubt i post a topic on this forum and ask for your opinions. (wich i greatly appreciate and respect).

    By no means is looking at pictures a good way of filtering the wron from right, but i think it is a aid for us newbies to get familiar with the known and obvious fakes that are out there.

    I started doing this after Ade's comment on another tk topic, were he said that this could help in spotting the dead give aways.
    And i thank Ade for pointing this idea out to us newbs's because i truly believe that this is a good way in taking the first carefull steps in this minefield of badges & insignia.

    Squadra33

  9. #8

    Default Re: SS Totenkof...real / fake

    That is very true, what you say. And i applaud you for that. I think that the point being made was someone will compare a few photos on the net, and then become the expert. I believe no malice was directed at you (not from me anyway) but understand some of us have been around for a long time ( and all of us are still learning)

  10. #9

    Default Re: SS Totenkof...real / fake

    thanks John,

    offcourse what also comes in to play, is that i am Dutch so english isn't my first language.
    This also could cause a few mis-understandings and perhaps some bad grammer from my side.
    But i think we are all wise enough to know when critisism is given it is for a constructive reason, and not to flame or belittle any individual.
    Therefor i take all comments to heart, and hopefully one day be as helpfull to new collectors as some of you are to me

  11. #10

    Default Re: SS Totenkof...real / fake

    Thats ok I've just been burnt to the tune of 400 on a set of DF cyphers....................one day.............one day

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