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Early war NCO visor

Article about: Here some photo's of my early war NCO visor in a fine tricot gabardine. Very nice quality as you can see.

  1. #11

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    Quote by BenVK View Post
    I have to say that there are some issues with this cap that I'm not comfortable with but I've already told Paul about that via PM first.

    If it is authentic, then I would suggest that it's not from an earlier period but rather a wartime piece and a later war period at that.
    Was wondering if the piece may be Italian made? Funny, but the little brad holding the back seam together looks pretty much like what Italians used to secure their leather liners to the steel helmet band. That particular type brad was prohibited for use by the Germans early on. That issue and the trikot wool itself look non German.....only a thought (?)

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  3. #12

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    I gonna inspect my visor today and check Ben's points of attention. As I am not new to this business I am not convinced by what Ben wrote. The hole in the tricot at the back is not accidantilly caused by a sharp item, more the knibbling from a mouse. The tricot does not look like the reproductions which are on the market. All parts of the visor are authentic as used during ww2. The buckram was available in black, white and off-white with different waves. This also was used in the crushers bands. This is my opinion and would like more convincing evidence. The cap is a beauty and putting it aside as a high end reproduction is not something you can do too easily.

  4. #13

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    Hi there.
    I have inspected the visor through and through.
    I agree the buckram is of a different pattern I see in my other caps, but this really is the only point of interest I can find.
    I also think it is very strange that you make a hole in the cloth so that you can show the non correct type of buckram to the rest of the world. For me this story does not sell.
    Having this visor in the hand you feel and see a high quality cap produced from top quality materials. It is rather heavy and there is not only buckram between the liner and the tricot but also a kind of woolen, soft material.

    The tricot is without any doubt wartime pattern with a rather fine wave. All other materials match the quality and are wartime pattern. The piece of paper with the size has aged and the metal split pen left an imprint (of age) in the cloth liner. Sorry to say that I am not convinced at this moment the visor is a reproduction.
    Paul

  5. #14
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    Happy to inspect the cap if you wish to send it to me?. Peter has already agreed to that.

    I could be wrong of course but from the photos, I still have concerns.
    A hands on inspection is a must though.

    This cap reminds me of another one that just didn't seem right to me although I couldn't find anything definitely "wrong" with it either. Different fabric of course though.

    SS Panzer NCO Cap - Wehrmacht-Awards.com Militaria Forums

  6. #15

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    Buckram allows the cap crown to stay fairly stiff and retain its shape. Behind the sides there should be interfacing and padding which can be gnarly old stuff but it gives the cap its body and enables it to be blocked.

    Never hesitate to put your face inside and smell these caps....they should have an old, musty, funk to them! Its one of the first things I do and its present across the board with this type of militaria....

  7. #16
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    I've NEVER seen a coarse buckram used in this application, only ever a treated cheesecloth which is much finer. There is also usually a ring of padding felt running around the circumference of the crown, which should be visible through that hole but is not. So I see what has Ben concerned.

  8. #17

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    At the inside there is a ring of padding visible. The whole capconstruction is quite firm.
    I show a photo of this padding later.

  9. #18

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    You have some beautiful artifacts sir, thank you for sharing. I'm am actually purchasing my first example, in black, right now, and though I've been lucky to have a fellow collector close by with several examples that he allows me to examine on a regular basics, I can't wait until I'm able to study my own example whenever I want. I'm truly looking forward to viewing the rest of your collection, keep it up.

  10. #19

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    Quote by Arran View Post
    I've NEVER seen a coarse buckram used in this application, only ever a treated cheesecloth which is much finer. There is also usually a ring of padding felt running around the circumference of the crown, which should be visible through that hole but is not. So I see what has Ben concerned.
    We may just be hung up on semantics or definitions....it is in fact 'like' a cheesecloth of which in, millinery or mutzenfabrik trade, differing weights. I too see the concern.

  11. #20
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    Guys, just to clarify, it's not the fact we can see the buckram/cheese cloth material through the hole, that's fairly typical construction.
    Its the material itself that has me puzzled, the strands seem to be very thick, i.e. a heavy weight cheese cloth.

    One of the key points of period German hat construction was the weight of the materials used which were as light as possible.

    Most replica/fake caps of the modern era are very heavy in comparison.
    Click to enlarge the picture Click to enlarge the picture Click image for larger version. 

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